ENIC

[Gutter Boy]

I guess it's impossible to say really.... However I think that with perhaps just one really top class addition (Tevez for example) we could well have achieved better results against any of Everton, Stoke, Sunderland, Norwich, QPR or Aston Villa... Even just an equaliser against Everton, QPR or Norwich would've done it!

There was a very clear defining moment we lost it though. Where it was all in our hands and we blew it.

It was against Villa where Redknapp substituted vdV (for Parker?) and settled for a draw, guaranteeing we finished 4th (but not 3rd).

 

[Mosquito_Coasting]

There was a very clear defining moment we lost it though. Where it was all in our hands and we blew it.

It was against Villa where Redknapp substituted vdV (for Parker?) and settled for a draw, guaranteeing we finished 4th (but not 3rd).

To be fair I think the Rose sending off was just as critical.

 

[scaramanga]

There was a very clear defining moment we lost it though. Where it was all in our hands and we blew it.

It was against Villa where Redknapp substituted vdV (for Parker?) and settled for a draw, guaranteeing we finished 4th (but not 3rd).

You missed out the bit where he guarantees his own bonus in that act.

I can still remember Parker doing his ridiculous pirouettes by our own corner flag in the last minutes like a little shire horse with one leg stuck in its own **** while our chance to pretty much guarantee a CL place dripped away.

 

[scaramanga]

To be fair I think the Rose sending off was just as critical.

I think that underestimates just how bad Villa were in that match and that season. We'd have been favourites with 8 or 9 men - especially as they had no intention of leaving their own half once they scored.

 

[NWND]

There was a very clear defining moment we lost it though. Where it was all in our hands and we blew it.

It was against Villa where Redknapp substituted vdV (for Parker?) and settled for a draw, guaranteeing we finished 4th (but not 3rd).

To be honest there is that point. There is also the point in my view where we were 2-0 up at the Goons and instead of doing what say Mourinho or Fergie or any other top manager would have done: Close down the game, frustrate them, restrict space, play defensive and hit on the break with our pace (which we had in Bale, Lennon and potentially Defoe in that squad), he sat back and did nothing and kept the game as an open attacking contest, when at the time it was only Arsenal who benefitted from the game being like that.

It's this game for me that tells that by this point his heart and mind wasn't 100% focused on Spurs.

If he'd done what he did at Villa in that match, we may not have suffered the catastrophic blow to our confidence and chances and given Arsenal the massive confidence boost they needed to overhaul what at the time was a large points margin between the two clubs.

Of course, even after this match 3rd place was comfortably ours to throw away and ultimately, you could probably point the finger more at our failure to get more points out of the Norwich, Stoke, QPR and Sunderland games.

It was the manner of the reverse against Arsenal from the position we'd got ourselves in in the first place, that demonstrated just how removed Redknapp was from the focus required at that level in the Premiership where the finest of margins always tip the balance between two good teams.

 

[Bullet]

At the time(Jan 2012) i thought we should have gone for Nikica Jelavić,he was with Rangers and they were wanting to sell to anyone,with fellow Croatian Modric here as well would have been a good link up,just £4 million,but i presume that was way out of Levy's budget !!!

He scored quite a few for Everton in the next few months.

You'd have to dig out the Jelavic figures for that season and the next really.

Seems like most strikers hit a purple patch and score a few goals and they are help up to show that we should have bought them... then they have a run of 7 goals in 100 matches or whatever and people keep quiet about it.


PS - I loved page 47 of this thread, lots of sense spoken, then DubaiSpur comes wading in expecting ludicrous investments, that just ain't gonna happen and derails this thread every few pages.

PPS - I also loved this from NWND - I think I'm going to get it tattooed across my chest

Who'd have known that the ridiculous curse of spurs would mean we must be the only club in the history of the universe to finish in a CL qualifying position only to have the worst Chelsea team assembled under Abramovich somehow ridiculously fluke their way through a double tie with Barcelona where Chelsea probably scored 3 goals with their only 3 attacks across both legs, whereas Barca failed to score more than 3 goals despite having 100 shots and hitting the post/bar abotu 5 times across both legs, not to mention the ridiculous final that Chelsea somehow fluked a draw out of despite scoring with their one attack all game and Bayern only scoring one goal from about 50 million chances.

NO, but BLAME IT ALL ON LEVY, It's ALL LEVY'S FAULT, IF ONLY HE'D GIVEN REDKNAPP A MANAGER ONLY JUST CLEARED OF TAX EVASION AND WHO MADE IT CLEAR HE'D BUGGER OFF TO MANAGE ENGLAND £40M TO SPEND ON PLAYERS IT WOULD ALL BE ALRIGHT, LEVY IS THE DEVILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

 

[DubaiSpur]

PS - I loved page 47 of this thread, lots of sense spoken, then DubaiSpur comes wading in expecting ludicrous investments, that just ain't gonna happen and derails this thread every few pages.

If you look down and celebrate beating West Ham, Villa, Everton and Saudi Sportswashing Machine to a player, then certainly, we're a big club compared to them.

By all means, continue doing so if you wish to: I certainly don't have any pretensions about waking some our fans from their sweet dalliances with the comforting mistruths that Levy and ENIC spin to justify the way they now run the club. We are a big club, we are run 'sensibly', we 'punch above our weight', we just need luck to go our way and nothing from the owners, we're a big club, look at Everton and Villa! We're a big club, the model of well run....big club...like Dortmund...big....zzzzzzzzz.

Sensible, sensible, sensible. I'm actually fairly confident that should the club start charging 10,000 pounds for season tickets and still somehow spunking it all on Stambouli and Fazio-type buys, there would still be some people praising our glorious owners for running the club the way they do, rounding on those who question the value the fans are getting from said tickets and the absolute Scrooge-style tight-fistedness from our owners during the impossibly rare times when, through luck and a bit of managerial skill, we actually get into a position where we can challenge for something.

Anyway, I'm sorry, didn't mean to ruin your pleasant browsing experiences. I'll allow the waves of self-reinforcing 'sense' to warmly lap over this thread once again.

 

[Finney Is Back]

There was a very clear defining moment we lost it though. Where it was all in our hands and we blew it.

It was against Villa where Redknapp substituted vdV (for Parker?) and settled for a draw, guaranteeing we finished 4th (but not 3rd).

Reading this I am assuming that you were not watching the game?.... VDV had had it physically, we were outnumbered and losing the battle. If I remember correctly (and it was a while ago so I could be wrong!) after Parker came on we started to dominate the game and could even have won it despite being down to 10 men.

 

[Finney Is Back]

To be honest there is that point. There is also the point in my view where we were 2-0 up at the Goons and instead of doing what say Mourinho or Fergie or any other top manager would have done: Close down the game, frustrate them, restrict space, play defensive and hit on the break with our pace (which we had in Bale, Lennon and potentially Defoe in that squad), he sat back and did nothing and kept the game as an open attacking contest, when at the time it was only Arsenal who benefitted from the game being like that.

It's this game for me that tells that by this point his heart and mind wasn't 100% focused on Spurs.

If he'd done what he did at Villa in that match, we may not have suffered the catastrophic blow to our confidence and chances and given Arsenal the massive confidence boost they needed to overhaul what at the time was a large points margin between the two clubs.

Of course, even after this match 3rd place was comfortably ours to throw away and ultimately, you could probably point the finger more at our failure to get more points out of the Norwich, Stoke, QPR and Sunderland games.

It was the manner of the reverse against Arsenal from the position we'd got ourselves in in the first place, that demonstrated just how removed Redknapp was from the focus required at that level in the Premiership where the finest of margins always tip the balance between two good teams.

I think Redknapp probably would've done that had we got to half time.... Again my memory might be playing tricks but I don't remember either Arsenal's 1st or 2nd goals being a result of us having too many players committed forward? Wasn't one of them a free kick and the other scored after we didn't clear our box properly?

 

[jimmyb]

By all means, continue doing so if you wish to: I certainly don't have any pretensions about waking some our fans from their sweet dalliances with the comforting mistruths that Levy and ENIC spin to justify the way they now run the club. We are a big club, we are run 'sensibly', we 'punch above our weight', we just need luck to go our way and nothing from the owners, we're a big club, look at Everton and Villa! We're a big club, the model of well run....big club...like Dortmund...big....zzzzzzzzz.

Sensible, sensible, sensible. I'm actually fairly confident that should the club start charging 10,000 pounds for season tickets and still somehow spunking it all on Stambouli and Fazio-type buys, there would still be some people praising our glorious owners for running the club the way they do, rounding on those who question the value the fans are getting from said tickets and the absolute Scrooge-style tight-fistedness from our owners during the impossibly rare times when, through luck and a bit of managerial skill, we actually get into a position where we can challenge for something.

Anyway, I'm sorry, didn't mean to ruin your pleasant browsing experiences. I'll allow the waves of self-reinforcing 'sense' to warmly lap over this thread once again.

Who has done that?

 

[Shelfie]

Surely Cahill would have helped us shore up our defence in the second half of that season. Instead he helped shore up Chelsea's, and they won the CL to mug us of our rightful CL place.

Once again we were defeated by the power of money.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Come on, we've been over this, Jim. A few days ago. And again a week before that when it came to the fans being blamed for being c*nty. I don't want to ruin Bullet's pleasant delusions, so I won't trawl back through the 'Ade' and 'Fans last night' threads looking for the aftermath of that shameless Ade deflection of responsibility.

 

[NWND]

I think Redknapp probably would've done that had we got to half time.... Again my memory might be playing tricks but I don't remember either Arsenal's 1st or 2nd goals being a result of us having too many players committed forward? Wasn't one of them a free kick and the other scored after we didn't clear our box properly?

Might have been but from what I remember they built up a steady attacking momentum partly because we were playing very open still whether they scored the goals from those situations or not I'm not sure but IMO Arsenal under Wenger are easy to frustrate if you play the right game 2-0 up and I just remember Redknapp didn't do anything to change things when it was clear in the match a change was needed

 

[jimmyb]

Come on, we've been over this, Jim. A few days ago. And again a week before that when it came to the fans being blamed for being c*nty. I don't want to ruin Bullet's pleasant delusions, so I won't trawl back through the 'Ade' and 'Fans last night' threads looking for the aftermath of that shameless Ade deflection of responsibility.

But who has rounded on anyone for the specific complaint that Spurs fans aren't getting value for money?

That wasn't the argument at all. The argument was about the behaviour of some fans during games that is ruining the experience for many other fans - not about anyone justifiably complaining that we aren't currently getting value for money.

 

[DubaiSpur]

No, that wasn't the argument at all. It might have been from you, but certainly not from a lot of other posters who swelled up in outrage at the mere mention of the possibility of fan discontent with the value they were getting from the prices they were paying, screeching 'ENTITLEMENT!' from the highest rooftops and beyond.

 

[jimmyb]

No, that wasn't the argument at all. It might have been from you, but certainly not from a lot of other posters who swelled up in outrage at the mere mention of the possibility of fan discontent with the value they were getting from the prices they were paying, screeching 'ENTITLEMENT!' from the highest rooftops and beyond.

I'm sorry, fella, but that is just wrong. I followed the discussion too and I don't remember anyone specifically criticising another fan for complaining about value for money.

The disapproval was for the selfish behaviour that accompanied the complaint. Not for the complaint itself. Big difference.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I'm sorry, fella, but that is just wrong. I followed the discussion too and I don't remember anyone specifically criticising another fan for complaining about value for money.

The disapproval was for the selfish behaviour that accompanied the complaint. Not for the complaint itself. Big difference.

I do remember the 'entitlement' card being whipped out early, and being used too much for my liking. The proof will be in the great GG archives, though: your'e certainly welcome to delve into them if you wish to verify my claim, although I myself honestly cannot be bothered to do so at this stage.Suffice it to say, I wish that word would be erased from the records of Spurs fans bitching at one another, because it's the most unbelievably stupid, mindless and short-sighted thing one fan could ever accuse another of.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I'm probably one of those silly people who used the 'entitlement' word, but feel a lot of modern fans do feel this. I've supported the club for nearly 60 years, I don't go expecting us to win anything I just go out of love of the club and the game (although I don't love it as much as I did). I've never given value for money a thought, it would be like asking if my wife and kids were worth all the money I've spent on them.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I'm probably one of those silly people who used the 'entitlement' word, but feel a lot of modern fans do feel this. I've supported the club for nearly 60 years, I don't go expecting us to win anything I just go out of love of the club and the game (although I don't love it as much as I did). I've never given value for money a thought, it would be like asking if my wife and kids were worth all the money I've spent on them.

It isn't entitlement to want owners who are at least as committed to the club as the fans are, though. Long, long gone, dead and buried are the prospects of fans actually owning the clubs they support here in England (the German model, which is close to perfect imo, will be stamped out here if it were ever tried very, very quickly). Failing that, let's at least not keep quiet when the owners contribute next to nothing to the club in the time they own it compared to what the fans put in every year, with loyalty to said owners ultimately turning some fans against their own kind and creating a fractious atmosphere that only too easily lends itself to the kind of venal back-and-forth mudslinging that we saw after those Ade comments.

Our fans aren't 'entitled'. Please, stop using that word: it is utterly macaronic, likely dishonest and completely vile given its ability to completely whitewash genuine fan concerns with an overwhelming sense of smug moral superiority and an 'us-versus-them' mentality.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

It isn't entitlement to want owners who are at least as committed to the club as the fans are, though. Long, long gone, dead and buried are the prospects of fans actually owning the clubs they support here in England (the German model, which is close to perfect imo, will be stamped out here if it were ever tried very, very quickly). Failing that, let's at least not keep quiet when the owners contribute next to nothing to the club in the time they own it compared to what the fans put in every year, with loyalty to said owners ultimately turning some fans against their own kind and creating a fractious atmosphere that only too easily lends itself to the kind of venal back-and-forth mudslinging that we saw after those Ade comments.

Our fans aren't 'entitled'. Please, stop using that word: it is utterly macaronic, likely dishonest and completely vile given its ability to completely whitewash genuine fan concerns with an overwhelming sense of smug moral superiority and an 'us-versus-them' mentality.

Nice to know I'm macaronic and dishonest, easy to see why you win so many people round with your reasoned argument and respect.