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ENIC

DubaiSpur said:
That's fair. I think it's a difficult situation where the chairman and his boss are almost entirely responsible for the state of the club, so just chanting support for the manager and the players is letting them get away with it.

Yes it does create a less positive atmosphere when people chant Levy Out. But on the other hand, it also accurately calls out who is really responsible for the club's current state, while taking blame *off* the manager and the players. So is it ideal? No. Is it the best outcome for the health of the club? I'd say so.



I don't think many people think chanting alone will bring down the ENIC regime. But it's a good start - gets the fans' unhappiness in the papers, leads to the media turning, which creates pressure on the club. Sure ENIC can ignore it, but it isn't a pleasant experience for them, and that's important in the longer term. Nothing happens in a day, and healing the club after 25 grinding years under ENIC will take time.
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You have been so negative about ENIC throughout the years and I get some of it and I am in the camp of it’s gone a bit stale for Levy and ENIC. I would be interested in knowing any positives that you have about them to balance your constant negatives. Again your are entitled to your opinion and like I said I understand your sentiment to a certain degree of variance.
 
Muttley said:
Not sure I'm fully understanding the current anti-ENIC narrative. Is it just heightened because of the run we're on?
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Probably the inevitable sacking of Ange when he has bene yet another manager who has suffered on the back of our transfer policies and visions to alignment of the initial appointment.

Usually when this happens the finger from board level is to deflect from their own failings and land entirely on the manager rather than the management. It’s deflection and a recycled tactic used over and over again. I’m sure there will be some sort of guff in a club statement knowing that it will not change. We are spending money but not correctly or as balanced as it should be.

Our ambitions stated from the hierarchy do not match the recruitment or strategy.
 
Muttley said:
Not sure I'm fully understanding the current anti-ENIC narrative. Is it just heightened because of the run we're on?
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More that the summer window finally brought an end to many people's patience with the way they do things. This current run only exposes those inadequacies - buying a bunch of cheap 18 year olds and one bloke from Bournemouth is predictably backfiring as injuries take their toll, but hey, at least we can point to having by far the lowest wages-to-turnover ratio in the league.

It doesn't help ENIC that a section of the fanbase actually genuinely likes Postecoglou as a manager and person, despite his own inadequacies. But a larger group have finally realized that the managers are not the problem at the club - the owners are, because managers keep changing but the one constant in place is the man in the chairman's box.

I wish we had this realization 5 years ago when we sacked Poch. Or even 1.75 years ago when Conte said exactly what I said above. But, better late than never.
 
Gazza said:
You have been so negative about ENIC throughout the years and I get some of it and I am in the camp of it’s gone a bit stale for Levy and ENIC. I would be interested in knowing any positives that you have about them to balance your constant negatives. Again your are entitled to your opinion and like I said I understand your sentiment to a certain degree of variance.
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I've said it before, but when he first came in, all the way up until roughly the mid-2010s, Levy had some genuinely ground-breaking ideas and an eye for talent. He was one of the first to bring the Director of Football model to English football, only for his pick, Arnesen, to be stolen by Chelsea. He persisted and brought in Comolli, who despite his flaws brought us players like Modric and Bale (and eventually went to Liverpool). He brought Michael Edwards to the club, who revolutionized our scouting and then eventually went to Liverpool. Even appointments like Alex Inglethorpe and John McDermott - they helped revolutionize our moribund youth system, and were rewarded with better jobs at Liverpool and the FA respectively.

The problem is, he never saw the problem being highlighted here - he brought in great people, but they were poached by clubs with more ambition than us (Chelsea, Liverpool) or just a better pay packet (FA). And to keep our progress going, he needed to keep replacing them with equally talented people - which, after the mid-2010s, dropped off as he picked numerous duds like Steve 'I hate January' Hitchen to lead player recruitment, and now this Lange and Munn duo (though they haven't had much time, it isn't looking promising so far).

His model imposed a hard ceiling on us - we would not compete with the ambitious clubs on wages and fees, so we had to compete by being better than them in our structure. But to do that, every appointment had to be right - eventually, they weren't, and we suffered for it. But he never changed his ways.
 
Gazza said:
Are you suggesting that opposing fans are going to away games and trying to oust Levy by chanting?

Or worse that every spurs fan is behind ENIC?
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It's singularly ironic when one of the number one chants delighted Goons and Chelsea fans throw at us derbies these days is 'Daniel Levy, we want you to stay'.

When your rivals delighting in your misfortune are pleading for your chairman to stay, it should tell you something. But sadly, the message hasn't yet become clear to many of us.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
I think the only thing I would say against ROTS (and re-enforced listening to a podcast clip he posted today) is that there is a lack of understanding that people have bought season tickets in particular areas and the club can’t just move them mid-season (or any season) saying ‘this is now a singing section’. So the club sends an email to ST holders to advise them that a particular block is designated a singing section for a certain game and if that’s not what you want you can buy a seat elsewhere. But ROTS seems to expect more and I’m not really sure what he can realistically expect.
I admire the effort he and THFC Flags and Spurs Song Sheet have put in but I think they’ve missed a trick as they could have used the current sentiment to advocate the club backing their efforts.
I do appreciate the brick wall they are facing though. I just believe it’s wrong to put it at Levy’s door - I doubt he’s particularly aware of that macro level of detail.
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The issue I have (and it not with their effort) is when does the lack of collaboration and their voice then become a negative against what they are trying to achieve. For me the post today (below) does that, the statement of "there is no singing section" in a game thats a QF when there would invariably be singing....you hope, is them throwing a wobbly which impact by throwing even more negativity to the subject. IMO they should be saying "despite our efforts lets not distract from an important game and lets all get behind the team wherever you are seated". Seems needless points scoring

For clarity I can appreciate what they do, I am not sure I agree with alot of their messaging, I do suspect with some of these groups (not saying this one) but some there is a level of placing themselves in areas they like to be associated with, I certainly feel that with the voice of Spurs or whatever his moniker is

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DubaiSpur said:
It's singularly ironic when one of the number one chants delighted Goons and Chelsea fans throw at us derbies these days is 'Daniel Levy, we want you to stay'.

When your rivals delighting in your misfortune are pleading for your chairman to stay, it should tell you something. But sadly, the message hasn't yet become clear to many of us.
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When did they start singing this??
 
DubaiSpur said:
Like I said mate, this is how it should be - I acknowledge this is not how it presently is.

If we arrive at a happy medium where the crowd back the manager and the players, but make the owners miserable, to me that's the healthiest and happiest outcome. Let's hope that happens.
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Hey I’d love new, rich, owners
And I personally don’t think the owners are the reason why we have so many injuries
And I’m actually fine with fans protesting.
All I ask is they stick with it
Don’t flip flop
You have stuck to your view and I credit you for that
 
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glorygloryeze said:
When did they start singing this?
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A year or two ago, iirc - I've heard it from their crowds multiple times since 2022.

Hell, Gooner knobheads are even going up to Levy and saying it to his face...


...and while I want Levy out, I also think this Goon is a prime plonker, so I'm not about to give him credit for it. Just pointing out that this is now a common refrain for those odious pricks.
 
DubaiSpur said:
That's fair. I think it's a difficult situation where the chairman and his boss are almost entirely responsible for the state of the club, so just chanting support for the manager and the players is letting them get away with it.

Yes it does create a less positive atmosphere when people chant Levy Out. But on the other hand, it also accurately calls out who is really responsible for the club's current state, while taking blame *off* the manager and the players. So is it ideal? No. Is it the best outcome for the health of the club? I'd say so.



I don't think many people think chanting alone will bring down the ENIC regime. But it's a good start - gets the fans' unhappiness in the papers, leads to the media turning, which creates pressure on the club. Sure ENIC can ignore it, but it isn't a pleasant experience for them, and that's important in the longer term. Nothing happens in a day, and healing the club after 25 grinding years under ENIC will take time.
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Why were they “grinding”? I think it says more about you than it does Enic. The truth is people invest their emotional energy into Spurs - we all do from Levy to fans to the stadium cleaner. But some don’t define themselves by Spurs success. They can make the separation and enjoy their ‘support’.

The mugs, who don’t have an alternative reality or vision, are essentially unhappy with themselves and displace it onto the club and enic.
 
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