Danny Rose

[Finney Is Back]

Right that is pretty condescending to say "don't be fooled" because where has anyone said Poch has made all players great? I fudging hate when people add brick to your point that you have not mentioned.

The overall point is has Rose' rise being so significant in the last year that warrants another pay rise? The rise last year was indicative of his progress in the previous two season, has he gone up such a level that he deserves more? I argue not. I would say his increases have been in line with his progression.

I never said he is replaceable, I know he is a hard replacement, so you have added that in at the end to add some value to your post.

Rose is taking a popular line that is self serving and not to the benefit of the club, someone made that point earlier and its nailed on, him trying to make himself out to be some kind of wolfie smith and other actually buying it is laughable.

Yes IMO he does warrant another pay rise. He is the best left back in the league. The player operating in the same position on the opposite flank has just gone for 2 to 3 times Rose's salary. If we were to replace Rose with somebody equally good then how much would we have to pay them do you think? I disagree completely with Rose's methods here but I do understand his sentiment. There are players at Crystal Palace earning more than him. Are any as good as he is? Are they the best player in their position in the league and right at their peak?

 

[Finney Is Back]

Poch isn't the type to do it publicly and embarrass Rose, but I suspect there'll be a good bit of whatever the modern equivalent of boot cleaning is before he gets back into the team.

I think he will be back in thr team as soon as he is fully fit (assuming we don't sell him). He is the best left back at the club and possibly in the whole PL.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I understand all that, however IF i had a agent and was as thick as Rose seems to be i would hope he would advise me about not doing the interview because the fall out would make me look worse. Which is just what has happened to Rose.

I disagree.... it will probably get him what he wants eventually... (a fat pay rise here ora move elsewhere with an even bigger fat pay rise)

 

[Rorschach]

That apology was a bit pathetic.

 

[Finney Is Back]

No but the thing is, the transfer window is not closed for 3 weeks, everyone seems to be ignoring that. We win against Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Siggy goes to Everton and we get barkley and somebody else prior to chelsea world looks a different place

Giroud been linked all over the place, mainly to Everton looks like arsenal want him gone.
Sakho A) is a liabilty B) wont play for them again after the run-in with Klopp

I think we are weaker in 1 position, However the age of the players will mean they will improve slightly in areas, we also have a few long term injured players returning. Even if one of them may be off

So has Dier been linked to several clubs... doesnt mean he is going. Looks like Giroud is happy to have a squad roke at Arsenal.... that is a good squad player to ha e. Indeed our young players are getting older.... as they are at all other clubs. Surely you cannot dispute that we are weaker currently, whereas 3 of last seasons top 6 are stronger? I am not panicking yet as there is still a few weeks to go. Let's hope we don't give ourselves too much of an uphill struggle to come back from after our opening games as we have so.etimes in the past.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I don't see Pochettino and Levy as the forgiving types. My guess he will go. On their terms.

Frankly I think Rose overestimated his value.

£50m transfer fee. £25m in wages over 5 years. Good as he is, it's Danny fudging Rose. Surely not even United are stupid enough to spend £75m on him.

I think Levy is about right to value him at £10m over 5 years.

On the best left back in the league? Of course they would. They pay Luke Shaw higher wages than 5 million a year.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Not really. Man United will spend £15m a year on him. We are spending £2m. We are closer to his real value.

You think we can get a player as good for £2 million a year?

 

[JPBB]

You think we can get a player as good for £2 million a year?

No not all at. Bur we don't need to. If Poch wants to forgive him. we have him for 2m at year

The point I am making is that £15m a year for Danny Rose is a lot. Even for United

 

[thfcsteff]

His apology is pure spin demanded by the club and written by his agents which allows Poch to say "he was wrong, he apologised, our focus is on the Saudi Sportswashing Machine game"

His agent was, apparently, unaware this interview had been given and was very, very embarrassed. Not sure how much I believe that, but is apparently the word. He would've been read the riot act by the club and Poch. This is, as you suggest, an attempt to retrieve a situation which has blown wonderfully up in his face.

I think Poch's press conference was a blinder.
Superb.
The man just goes from strength to strength. It is as if he almost offered pity for Rose, as if he suggested he is a bit bonkers.

In fact, and let me go speculative record here, I am guessing we will soon hear stories of Rose suffering from 'depression' and tales of 'he feared he'd never play again' etc, etc. I hope I'm wrong -it would muddy the waters for those whose depression is real- but I would not be surprised. Again this last bit is TOTAL conjecture on my part, a guess.

Anyway, well played Poch, well played Levy, well player Tottenham!


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[thfcsteff]

I don't disagree with the manner was wrong, but it is an underlying issue at the club.

How someone can claim to be underpaid on 65k a week when a nurse makes 20 a year is beyond me, but sadly that's football.

How many times does it have to be said...the club are NOT STUPID and will have addressed concerns and questions to this regard a while ago.


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[thfcsteff]

The middle of road player thing until Poch is a fallacy. He has improved under Pochettino due to gaining more experience in the position and also due to our team having a much more defined pattern of play and a more organised defensive structure overall. However it was clear that Rose was already a very good player.

No it is not a fallacy.
He has been taught how to bring together his pace with defensive duties, specifically being taught angles and positional things which he simply did not have before. Sunderland? Of course he looked good there - they were and are brick - and our system is designed to allow wing-backs to flourish. Rose was a good player with issues who needed an attitude adjustment. He responded well to Davies coming in, that is fair comment, but make no mistake, Poch turned him into the player he is.


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[Wilheldiva]

I don't disagree with the manner was wrong, but it is an underlying issue at the club.

How someone can claim to be underpaid on 65k a week when a nurse makes 20 a year is beyond me, but sadly that's football.

theres kids in some part of the world that are thinking exactly the same thing about uk nurses. its all relative...

for what he is/does, put simply, rose (and most of our squad) is being mugged off atm. We have handfuls of first team players than should be on 3x what they are on atm

 

[milo]

On the best left back in the league? Of course they would. They pay Luke Shaw higher wages than 5 million a year.

I agree that he is the best LB in the league and richer clubs than us are paying poorer players a lot more (a load of poorer clubs are paying poorer player more too but...). I do think though that we will soon be reaching the optimum time to sell him. The point where his value is highest but that he only has a season or two left in him at that level. I can see that point being next summer and think that there is sense in holding onto him until then and then cashing in.

 

[Jordinho]

theres kids in some part of the world that are thinking exactly the same thing about uk nurses. its all relative...

for what he is/does, put simply, rose (and most of our squad) is being mugged off atm. We have handfuls of first team players than should be on 3x what they are on atm

They COULD be on 3x what they're on, but there isn't a person in the world who SHOULD be making that kind of money no matter what job they do.

 

[Wilheldiva]

They COULD be on 3x what they're on, but there isn't a person in the world who SHOULD be making that kind of money no matter what job they do.

ive been hearing that nurses and firemen do...

anyways what does it matter what anyone else makes?

 

[Hotshot-Tottenham]

theres kids in some part of the world that are thinking exactly the same thing about uk nurses. its all relative...

for what he is/does, put simply, rose (and most of our squad) is being mugged off atm. We have handfuls of first team players than should be on 3x what they are on atm

Why did they all sign their contracts then?

 

[thfcsteff]

Rose also played well under AVB before he got some injury problems -- iirc he struggled for form after coming back from injury but got back on track in the end. A lot of people made their minds up about Rose and they were wrong. Now the narrative has changed to "Poch made him" but that isn't true either. Poch has improved him, but he was already a good player, on the way to becoming a very good one.

But CRITICALLY he suffered from mental lapses which prevented him from being great. Time and time again. He would not have become a great player without great coaching, and looking at the character which presents himself to the world, a coach like Mourinho would've failed with him because Rose is a hot-head. I gave him great praise for fighting to win his shirt when Davies came in and not going to Sunderland or wherever (because remember THOSE were the only clubs who would touch him) but to deny that Poch made him a next level player is, IMO, wrong.


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[DeleHarry]

Why did they all sign their contracts then?

they got Levy'd. They had no chance

 

[Wilheldiva]

Why did they all sign their contracts then?

and now theyre excercising their rights to ask for a payrise

why did the nurses sign their contratcs?

 

[thfcsteff]

A lot of revisionism going on. We’re a different team with Rose. He might have sealed his early departure from the club, but there’s no doubt we’ll be worse of for it.

I imagine a LB will be on our radar very soon, which will hopefully minimise it. Shaw and Sessegnon would be good.

Who played in his position from January last season and how did we do?
No revisionism. Yes, a tremendous asset when fit and adjusted, but the notion that he is even the sixth most important player at the club is wide of the mark. Well wide. In fact, saying we will be 'worse' for it about a player who played no part in our season after January (one which saw us finish higher than ever and with the best defensive record in the league) is revisionism in my book.


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