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Another shooting in Murica

If the citizens of the country haven't got the nouse to sort the problem that's their look out.
Personally I'm past caring. They have "a target rich environment" and the loonies amongst them have enough weapons to take full advantage.
 
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Robbo said:
It's so predictable, isn't it. The shooting and the replies - it's an endless cycle. Like groundhog day, really.
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Yes. And the staggering thing is that nobody's mind gets changed. You'd have thought that there would be a spectrum of views, with gun rights enthusiasts, gun industry lobbyists and libertarians on one end, and what for some reason Americans call "liberals" (and we would, I guess, call social democrats - or just "voices of sanity") on the other. And you'd have thought that whenever something like Sandy Hook, or this, happens, then most people would be shifted along that spectrum somewhat, and some would be converted to support for much tighter gun laws.

But that doesn't seem to happen. There's something about divisive, culture-war issues that means that opinion stays static, even when the facts change. No matter how many children are murdered, the debate doesn't change, as you say.

And that's worrying from a more general perspective, considering polarised issues elsewhere. Brexit, for instance. However bad things get, however screwed UK businesses are, however much overseas investment flees, however many lorries of rotten produce stack up on the M20, Leave voters will carry on denying reality. Because it's one of those issues which cut deeper than facts, too fundamental to people's conception of their own political persuasion for them ever to admit that they have been wrong.

Humans, ffs. They're really not fit for purpose. And they certainly shouldn't be allowed to vote.
 
StephenH said:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/04/opinion/thoughts-prayers-nra-funding-senators.html

More info

Corruption pure and simply.
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I wish it was pure and simple. It's not, though.

If it was just a matter of an evil gun industry wanting to sell death and buy political influence, things would be simpler. It only took a generation to get big tobacco on the run.

The problem is that the gun lobbyists are pushing at an open door. And the door is open because Americans are really fudging odd. The gun fetish, the paranoia about government - you don't get either of those to anything like the same extent in any other civilised country.
 
Seedy Ron said:
Don't they view all that as a restriction on them all getting tooled up? It's their constitutional right to pretend to be John Rambo.
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Well yes they do but it is a matter of interpretation really. The 2nd ammendment specifies the right to bear arms (of no specific description ) but in the context of a regulated militia (which nobody is in). So it is open to widely different interpretations really and that is also to ignore the context of the time it was written, the arms that were available then versus now, the fact that there was no police force at the time, and it is an ammendment to begin with (i.e. a change from the original consitution).
The point of this ammendment was obviously to allow the people a means to deal with an insurrection or a slave uprising, or overthrow an onerous government that was oppressing them and not for shooting each other when they got upset. A point ignored by those good old boys who love their guns.

The US government could fix or at least improve the situation if they wanted to but they don't. Money (edit: and Fox news!) decides american policy
 
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ShipOfGoldblum said:
I wish it was pure and simple. It's not, though.

If it was just a matter of an evil gun industry wanting to sell death and buy political influence, things would be simpler. It only took a generation to get big tobacco on the run.

The problem is that the gun lobbyists are pushing at an open door. And the door is open because Americans are really fudging odd. The gun fetish, the paranoia about government - you don't get either of those to anything like the same extent in any other civilised country.
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Sadly the US is lost.
 
Rorschach said:
Well yes they do but it is a matter of interpretation really. The 2nd ammendment specifies the right to bear arms (of no specific description ) but in the context of a regulated militia (which nobody is in). So it is open to widely different interpretations really and that is also to ignore the context of the time it was written, the arms that were available then versus now, the fact that there was no police force at the time, and it is an ammendment to begin with (i.e. a change from the original consitution).
The point of this ammendment was obviously to allow the people a means to deal with an insurrection or a slave uprising, or overthrow an onerous government that was oppressing them and not for shooting each other when they got upset. A point ignored by those good old boys who love their guns.

The US government could fix or at least improve the situation if they wanted to but they don't. Money (edit: and Fox news!) decides american policy
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Yeah, but they know all that, and don't do anything. It's a nonsense that something that is itself an amendment, a change, is considered sacrosanct and cannot be changed to move with the times, but they'll know that too, and still don't do anything. Anywhere else, the first load of dead kids would've been so mortifying that changes would've been a given, America - nothing.

They're a bunch of mentalists.
 
No exaggeration, the first thing one of my co-worker said to me was, "we need to arm the principal and the senior teachers...they need to be packing" So we know what Tucker Carlson & Sean Hannity were spouting last night.
 
Agaian many children dead, again nothing will change.

Again, the immeadiate response is to say it’s too early to talk about gun control, it’s not the right time. By that logic, it’ll never be the right time, it’ll happen again next week, and the week after that...
 
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