Ange in or out?

[GlennGoddle]

Right, with a much lower standard of player. His Australia team that you referenced played Chile, Netherlands and Spain in the World Cup. An insane draw. Yet we came out of that tournament with a lot of praise, and should really have beaten the Netherlands. He then won the Asian Cup the following year.

In 2021/22 he was knocked out in the Champions League players in his first couple of weeks. In his second season they lost to Real Madrid, RB Leipzig and got 2 draws with Shakhtar Donetsk.

Would you be this staunch if he wasn't Australian? I'm not being a knob I'm genuinely curious

 

[tommysvr]

Would you be this staunch if he wasn't Australian? I'm not being a knob I'm genuinely curious

It’s hard to answer, but I’m far from the most patriotic Australian around — I live in Japan for a reason — so I don’t think so. But maybe I have more patience because I’ve seen what he’s done in the past and that’s only due me being Australian?

FWIW, I absolutely hated him when he was Brisbane and Melbourne manager. I was a Sydney FC season ticket holder when he managed in the A-League and I thought he came across as a complete knobhead, similar to some of the things I see about him now. He also frustrated the hell out of me in 2018 World Cup Qualifying campaign. But he’s met every challenge I’ve seen him take on and it’s hugely impressive.

To do that as an Australian does carry some weight though. Maybe that’s where my nationality comes into it. He’s the first Australian to manage in a major European league. He got there all on merit, nothing else. To see him labelled “clueless” and other derogatory things simultaneously makes me laugh and winds me up.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Ange reminds me a bit of the Boxer Rebellion. Extreme prowess in karate is brilliant. Until you meet guns.

 

[Raziel]

I'm questioning how we spent it. I'm not entirely enthused that us buying a bunch of kids without a mix of experience was the greatest move.
I understand the strategy but again it will be a 2 yr wait at best for it to gel, if Ange stays that long.

It also doesn't help with the youth we have.....loaned out all our youth set-up. Have them play a little. Then go spend X amount on Tel who may or may not stay.

And prior covid, Enic have proven not to go that extra mile for our squad when needed. Someone mentioned if we wanted Nike, we got the the Teemu version. And I believe that still won't change. Just hidden behind getting "youth". And the chances of us finding more prime Ali and Kanes, are lower than us having Skipps, Winks etc.

I think fans spin brick however they want

- VDV was the cheap option, club was too skint to buy Todibo
- Vic was the cheap option, club was too skint to buy Raya
- Spence was a club signing
- Danso was 3rd choice
- Deki, Bentancur, Porro, Danso are all the "brick January" signings Spurs always makes

See how that goes? anybody want to revise any of those calls?

To your point about finding Dele's vs Winks, Gray & Bergvall say hi! Re our youth players in general, Donley, Keeley, Vuskovich are benefitting way more from playing consistently than being here, I expect Moore to go out next season as well.

Ange has repeatedly said, he could have had a couple more experienced players but the trade off would have been no Gray, and that's a call he wasn't comfortable with.

I think the reason Ange still has a job is because the club knew a full squad refresh was needed (yes, a few years late) and the only way to do that was to probably have a few more youth players than ideal in the mix (alongside the Maddison, Solanke, Danso signings).

 

[Lilbaz]

I think fans spin brick however they want

- VDV was the cheap option, club was too skint to buy Todibo
- Vic was the cheap option, club was too skint to buy Raya
- Spence was a club signing
- Danso was 3rd choice
- Deki, Bentancur, Porro, Danso are all the "brick January" signings Spurs always makes

See how that goes? anybody want to revise any of those calls?

To your point about finding Dele's vs Winks, Gray & Bergvall say hi! Re our youth players in general, Donley, Keeley, Vuskovich are benefitting way more from playing consistently than being here, I expect Moore to go out next season as well.

Ange has repeatedly said, he could have had a couple more experienced players but the trade off would have been no Gray, and that's a call he wasn't comfortable with.

I think the reason Ange still has a job is because the club knew a full squad refresh was needed (yes, a few years late) and the only way to do that was to probably have a few more youth players than ideal in the mix (alongside the Maddison, Solanke, Danso signings).

Buying young hungry players. Has been far more beneficial for us over the last 2 decades than spending big on "proven".
Eriksen, bale, walker, rose, carrick, modric...

You need a mix obviously.

 

[Jurgen the German]

He said it once that I know of. He's managed for a very long time. I don't recall it being a problem before but I also don't recall every part of his career.

I also have no seen any evidence of him being at fault, and I think people that throw that accusation around, with literally no knowledge of the situation other than "we've had lots of injuries," are being malicious.

If evidence comes out to support the claim, I'll happily revise my stance.

He did say injuries are normal whilst players get adjusted to his methods. We know for a fact that VDV and Romero started against Chelsea and both couldn’t make it through the game. We also know we have been plagued with injuries two seasons in a row. We will never fully know what causes them and there is always an element of luck, but given the issues he has had with injuries it’s a fair question to ask if his methods are a factor, or at the very least, if they are making things worse.

 

[Gazza]

It’s hard to answer, but I’m far from the most patriotic Australian around — I live in Japan for a reason — so I don’t think so. But maybe I have more patience because I’ve seen what he’s done in the past and that’s only due me being Australian?

FWIW, I absolutely hated him when he was Brisbane and Melbourne manager. I was a Sydney FC season ticket holder when he managed in the A-League and I thought he came across as a complete knobhead, similar to some of the things I see about him now. He also frustrated the hell out of me in 2018 World Cup Qualifying campaign. But he’s met every challenge I’ve seen him take on and it’s hugely impressive.

To do that as an Australian does carry some weight though. Maybe that’s where my nationality comes into it. He’s the first Australian to manage in a major European league. He got there all on merit, nothing else. To see him labelled “clueless” and other derogatory things simultaneously makes me laugh and winds me up.

Fair enough … but Ange at the helm thus far has made me cry and wound me up

 

[Jurgen the German]

I could never understand whether Kane was nurtured to that mentality or whether he was born that way. One thing I would say is that there was nothing talismanic about him for club or country when we really needed a talisman. Other clubs had less than complete teams, but their great players dragged them through. That certainly wasn't the case with Kane, Eriksen, Son etc. Kane wasn't alone in that mentality gap. The ones that may have had it were guys like Walker, Rose and Dele in my opinion. They had that different mentality. You could see it when they played in the toughest games.

With this current setup, we're just in a bad phase right now. I genuinely believe we have more mentality players than we give ourselves credit for. I enjoy having Venom, Porro, Gray, Bergval, Sarr, Solanke etc. These guys have potential to win things because of the way they cross the white line and the attitude they show on the pitch. We need more of that.

I agree about Kane not having that killer instinct. He’s the same for England in big games. He doesn’t score if he’s not in the right place at the right time and he just trots about passively, doesn’t create, doesn’t make life difficult for defenders.

I’d disagree about Alli. I’d say Rose was the only player who seemed to really relish the big occasion.

 

[afsoc4life]

It’s hard to answer, but I’m far from the most patriotic Australian around — I live in Japan for a reason — so I don’t think so. But maybe I have more patience because I’ve seen what he’s done in the past and that’s only due me being Australian?

FWIW, I absolutely hated him when he was Brisbane and Melbourne manager. I was a Sydney FC season ticket holder when he managed in the A-League and I thought he came across as a complete knobhead, similar to some of the things I see about him now. He also frustrated the hell out of me in 2018 World Cup Qualifying campaign. But he’s met every challenge I’ve seen him take on and it’s hugely impressive.

To do that as an Australian does carry some weight though. Maybe that’s where my nationality comes into it. He’s the first Australian to manage in a major European league. He got there all on merit, nothing else. To see him labelled “clueless” and other derogatory things simultaneously makes me laugh and winds me up.

I agree with the last paragraph especially. There are many times I have considered walking away from this forum because of this. I wonder what would happen if the manager was Nigerian and Spurs were not doing well, what language would one see?