Adam Johnson Case - Post Sensibly

[thfcsteff]

yes lets not get carried away - it's still alleged at this point

Yes, I am well aware it is 'alleged' at this point - thus why I said 'reportedly and 'if' he is guilty. I stand by every single word of what I said, and a few more, 'if' he is 'guilty'...it is also why I said the fact his name has been leaked is 'problematic' because it is still 'alleged'...

 

[SoundAndVision]

why are people surprised he cheated on his wife because she is relatively attractive?

 

[thfcsteff]

Again, IF he is innocent, then his name getting out is either

a) a stitch up from a powerful place or
b) a stitch up from a powerful place

The mere fact his name has already been released, let alone the nature of the investigation, narrows down the possibilities. Having said that, yes, until proven guilty, etc...

But let me ask a rational question. Unless the entire thing is fiction, why is he even in a situation where it is possible for such an 'accusation' to be made if he is a wonderful, upstanding citizen?

 

[SoundAndVision]

She's a beauty.

looks like a standard footballers wife.

 

[thfcsteff]

why are people surprised he cheated on his wife because she is relatively attractive?

Agreed. It is not usually even remotely a factor sadly. People are driven by some very strange 'needs'...

 

[thfcsteff]

Woah has he even been found guilty yet? No one knows the circumstances and yet you are still on his back.

Yes.
You're right.
I wish I hadn't seen anything until there was conclusive proof. There again, why is it that we DID see anything? And why is a 27 year old even in a situation where it is remotely possible that this has occurred?
Genuine questions inviting a genuine discussion mate, not trying to argue, and I would certainly cop to the fact that I have an especially dim view of, and very feral response to, anything of this nature.

 

[SoundAndVision]

Agreed. It is not usually even remotely a factor sadly. People are driven by some very strange 'needs'...

Its human nature, it dosnt matter how attractive a women is, it still gets boring having sex with the same one after a while.Not that im condoning what he did.

 

[Yiddo]

Yes.
You're right.
I wish I hadn't seen anything until there was conclusive proof. There again, why is it that we DID see anything? And why is a 27 year old even in a situation where it is remotely possible that this has occurred?
Genuine questions inviting a genuine discussion mate, not trying to argue, and I would certainly cop to the fact that I have an especially dim view of, and very feral response to, anything of this nature.

Could be something completely innocent, like pulling a bird at a nightclub. We have all seen young girls who are nowhere near 18 get in nightclubs and a few people have been in the same boat with underage girls due to this. Then again he may just be a dirty bastard but i am not going to judge until there is evidence of it.

 

[thfcsteff]

Its human nature, it dosnt matter how attractive a women is, it still gets boring having sex with the same one after a while.Not that im condoning what he did.

Brings up a really interesting debate. I am going to take the 'human nature' as referring to cheating with people who are of legal consent just to be clear (I know that's what you meant)...it IS human nature to a degree, but equally, it depends on what is driving you. IF you choose to get married young, then you have an obligation to the choice and should control yourself IMO. If you cannot, either don't get married or be straight-up about things (in this regard only, perhaps he and his wife have an 'arrangement')...but for some it becomes about something beyond even that...anyway...again, I agree with your point but think it opens up some very interesting philosophical questions which when I consider my answers, leave me in a place of being old fashioned!!!!!

 

[SoundAndVision]

Could be something completely innocent, like pulling a bird at a nightclub. We have all seen young girls who are nowhere near 18 get in nightclubs and a few people have been in the same boat with underage girls due to this. Then again he may just be a dirty bastard but i am not going to judge until there is evidence of it.

would you have thought he was a dirty bastard if she was 16? Honest question.

 

[thfcsteff]

Could be something completely innocent, like pulling a bird at a nightclub. We have all seen young girls who are nowhere near 18 get in nightclubs and a few people have been in the same boat with underage girls due to this. Then again he may just be a dirty bastard but i am not going to judge until there is evidence of it.

Probably because of my age and decades spent in many party pots, I am not buying that as an excuse mate. I see what you're saying, and frankly not being 27 (20 years older!) I only have memories of that era in my life. But for me PERSONALLY it wasn't about pulling birds who were that much younger than me. I could tell. I've seen the 'sneakers' and it makes me sad. I've seen the people praying on them and that makes me sad too. I think you're absolutely right when you say people have been in the same boat, but for me, those margins become a case of age gap. If you're, say, 19 and you shag a girl who is 17, then I think you're 'playing' in the same 'arena'. I was sexually active when I was 14-15, but those first few years it was with other like-minded teenage fumblers. But if you are 27 and playing in those fields, let alone when you're living with someone, then it takes on a whole new set of issues for me and puts you into a 'creepy' category. Again, I am aware this is a personal evaluation, and possibly a little strict so-to-speak, but there we go, cant hide who we are... well, I suppose I didn't need to post but you know what I mean mate ;-)

 

[SoundAndVision]

Brings up a really interesting debate. I am going to take the 'human nature' as referring to cheating with people who are of legal consent just to be clear (I know that's what you meant)...it IS human nature to a degree, but equally, it depends on what is driving you. IF you choose to get married young, then you have an obligation to the choice and should control yourself IMO. If you cannot, either don't get married or be straight-up about things (in this regard only, perhaps he and his wife have an 'arrangement')...but for some it becomes about something beyond even that...anyway...again, I agree with your point but think it opens up some very interesting philosophical questions which when I consider my answers, leave me in a place of being old fashioned!!!!!

I honestly have no idea why any footballer would get married in his 20's, its literally a license to have sex with as many attractive women as you wish no matter what you look like.

 

[Yiddo]

would you have thought he was a dirty bastard if she was 16? Honest question.

Well yeah, regardless of when the legal age is they are still very young. Just because the legal age in other countries is 13 or 14 doesn't make it right sleeping with kids at that age.

 

[Yiddo]

Probably because of my age and decades spent in many party pots, I am not buying that as an excuse mate. I see what you're saying, and frankly not being 27 (20 years older!) I only have memories of that era in my life. But for me PERSONALLY it wasn't about pulling birds who were that much younger than me. I could tell. I've seen the 'sneakers' and it makes me sad. I've seen the people praying on them and that makes me sad too. I think you're absolutely right when you say people have been in the same boat, but for me, those margins become a case of age gap. If you're, say, 19 and you shag a girl who is 17, then I think you're 'playing' in the same 'arena'. I was sexually active when I was 14-15, but those first few years it was with other like-minded teenage fumblers. But if you are 27 and playing in those fields, let alone when you're living with someone, then it takes on a whole new set of issues for me and puts you into a 'creepy' category. Again, I am aware this is a personal evaluation, and possibly a little strict so-to-speak, but there we go, cant hide who we are... well, I suppose I didn't need to post but you know what I mean mate ;-)

I guess its each to their own isn't it? i mean if you ask 100 middle aged men if they would sleep with an attractive 18 year old if it was offered i am sure atleast half would say yes regardless of if they have a partner or not.

 

[thfcsteff]

I honestly have no idea why any footballer would get married in his 20's, its literally a license to have sex with as many attractive women as you wish no matter what you look like.

I think it depends on who you are though. Some people know themselves well enough to be honest enough to realize that such an era is potentially one where you can play to your heart's content if that is what drives you. Others, such as Gareth Bale and Paul Scholes, seem to have realized early on that they are not of that nature and it appears to be working out for them (Scholes, obviously, has already been through the career bit). It comes down to being honest with yourself nd knowing who you are (as best you can) to the extent that such a decision is honest for all concerned.

 

[thfcsteff]

I guess its each to their own isn't it? i mean if you ask 100 middle aged men if they would sleep with an attractive 18 year old if it was offered i am sure atleast half would say yes regardless of if they have a partner or not.

I wouldn't disagree.
Societies and cultures the world over appear littered with such unions mate.
However, 15 or 16 is too much. Way too much.

 

[thfcsteff]

One thing I should say is that no red-blooded male in their right mind would look at an attractive 18 year old and not be turned on. But it's how you act which dictates the situation. I have certainly looked at many very attractive 18-20 year old women and said as much, but would I ever act? No. Have I had the chance? Absolutely. It's just not who I personally am. But Yiddo makes a good point, there are all sorts of people in the world and as long as no-one is hurt and everyone is happy then right on and stuff my personal judgement! BUT I think anyone, especially men in their late 20s, knows when someone is 15. And if they still act, it is pedophilia by law and also by deed.

 

[SoundAndVision]

I wouldn't disagree.
Societies and cultures the world over appear littered with such unions mate.
However, 15 or 16 is too much. Way too much.

its too simplistic to base it purely on age, you get girls at 15 which are clearly fully developed and have a womans body, (and its natural as a man to find a womans body attractive) yet you get girls at 17/18 that still look very childlike, but one is legal and one isnt (in the uk anyway) .

 

[thfcsteff]

its too simplistic to base it purely on age, you get girls at 15 which are clearly fully developed and have a womans body, (and its natural as a man to find a womans body attractive) yet you get girls at 17/18 that still look very childlike, but one is legal and one isnt (in the uk anyway) .

People know. Mate, you will know quickly enough and if you want to play those lines then fudging well ASK for their age or ID, because as an adult it is your responsibility!!!!! Personally, and again, if in your late 20s/early 30s you are playing in fields quite evidently younger than yours,then I personally have problems. I have children mate. I have a daughter. I am well aware of development versus age. Trust me. And if I were to get into this topic any deeper, you would see that my reasons and opinions are to do with a variety of things which are attendant i.e. when you are dealing with teenagers they are still developing in terms of maturity as much as anything, thus if you engage them in sexual activity you are technically praying on a dimension of 'innocence' which should be left to develop within it's own age range. Sorry. That's how I personally feel. Trust me, my opinions aren't simplistic mate...

 

[SoundAndVision]

People know.
And in your late 20s/early 30s,I am sorry, if you are playing in fields quite evidently younger than yours,then I personally have problems. I have children mate. I have a daughter. I am well aware of development versus age. Trust me. And if I were to get into this topic any deeper, you would see that my reasons and opinions are to do with a variety of things which are attendant i.e. when you are dealing with teenagers they are still developing in terms of maturity as much as anything, thus if you engage them in sexual activity you are technically praying on a dimension of 'innocence' which should be left to develop within it's own age range. Sorry. That's how I personally feel. Trust me, my opinions aren't simplistic mate...

I understand what you are saying, yes it would be odd for someone of that age to be pursuing 15/16 year olds, but how much more developed is an 18 year olds brain than a 15/16 year old? A man or womans brain dosn't stop developing until atleast 25, so technically anyone under that age couldnt be considered a fully mature adult yet, so should we just make the legal age 25?