Levy's Plan

[harr1984]

I think we all need to wait and see on how things are over time

That includes everyone who claimed we are now a serious club in the summer because of how were are operating, we may well have had out pants pulled down on some of the summer signings as we have in previous deals under Levy (not sure anyone is denying that), but it wouldn't reflect the serious club drum which was being banged.

You're right about the giving it time for sure, in terms of results. But a serious club backs the manager with his targets and gets them in early which we did for the most part aswell as selling in good time.

If the manager fails then that's on him - it's not like managers don't flop at the big clubs. You are more than welcome to debate whether he was the right choice of manager, but we have behaved like any serious club would in the market and we have increased our wage structure to do so.

For the first time in forever no one can make excuses for the manager because he has been given what he wants and left to do things his way. And the owners haven't broken the bank to do it....

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

You're right about the giving it time for sure, in terms of results. But a serious club backs the manager with his targets and gets them in early which we did for the most part aswell as selling in good time.

If the manager fails then that's on him - it's not like managers don't flop at the big clubs. You are more than welcome to debate whether he was the right choice of manager, but we have behaved like any serious club would in the market and we have increased our wage structure to do so.

Not in modern football its not, sorry I don't agree with it. You don't employ and invest millions into a recruitment team and data for all signings to be on the manager now and if you are doing that as a club you are equally foolish in the modern world.

For the first time in forever no one can make excuses for the manager because he has been given what he wants and left to do things his way. And the owners haven't broken the bank to do it....

We are taking loans on future earnings and having to input cash to improve cash flow, I think our banks creaking if its not broken yet. Despite the comments on here previous that all clubs do it, we are in some pretty unserious team company on those that have taken those loans

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

You're right about the giving it time for sure, in terms of results. But a serious club backs the manager with his targets and gets them in early which we did for the most part aswell as selling in good time.

If the manager fails then that's on him - it's not like managers don't flop at the big clubs. You are more than welcome to debate whether he was the right choice of manager, but we have behaved like any serious club would in the market and we have increased our wage structure to do so.

For the first time in forever no one can make excuses for the manager because he has been given what he wants and left to do things his way. And the owners haven't broken the bank to do it....

Yeah this is it. For the first time in a long time we haven’t really left the manager anything to complain about from an owner perspective. They have very obviously trusted and backed him. And competed with top clubs for players, and paid the wages and moved early enough to do the deals.

It does not mean we will definitely be successful, at some point it has to come together on the pitch. But the owners and VV absolutely levelled us up in the market and acted like a club that was prioritising football success.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Not in modern football its not, sorry I don't agree with it. You don't employ and invest millions into a recruitment team and data for all signings to be on the manager now and if you are doing that as a club you are equally foolish in the modern world.



We are taking loans on future earnings and having to input cash to improve cash flow, I think our banks creaking if its not broken yet. Despite the comments on here previous that all clubs do it, we are in some pretty unserious team company on those that have taken those loans

Ok, it’s not just the manager, there’s a whole team around. Agreed. But what more would you realistically have wanted our owners to do this summer? I think you have to say that at a minimum they have done their job. And now it’s on the players and staff to deliver.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Ok, it’s not just the manager, there’s a whole team around. Agreed. But what more would you realistically have wanted our owners to do this summer? I think you have to say that at a minimum they have done their job. And now it’s on the players and staff to deliver.

Its a long and I suspect futile answer to give because It will likely be met with matter of fact responses. But I will give you the short, I would not have swapped out Vusko for JPVH, I certainly would not have paid 75m for Savio, I would not freeze out Richy (he would not be at the club) and I would have had another Striker in (rather than all the CB deals) and I certainly would not have run the RB injury gauntlet.

And to be clear, I personally think there are fine lines between backing a manager, overpaying drastically to do so and being serious, I think its much more nuanced than just the money spent as I do the success of the window (as I have said often).

Anyway only time will tell if all we are doing as a club is the step up from the previous "regime" that some claim, for me there are the same red flags and I still think they are the same owners and decision makers we have always had, but there is zero point debating that anymore

 

[Muttley]

Its a long and suspect futile answer to give because It will likely be met with matter of fact responses. But I will give you the short, I would not have swapped out Vusko for JPVH, I certainly would not have paid 75m for Savio, I would not freeze out Richy (he would not be at the club) and I would have had another Striker in (rather than all the CB deals) and I certainly would not have run the RB injury gauntlet.

And to be clear, I personally think there are fine lines between backing a manager, overpaying drastically to do so and being serious, I think its much more nuanced than just the money spent as I do the success of the window (as I have said often).

Anyway only time will tell if all we are doing as a club is the step up from the previous "regime" that some claim, for me there are the same red flags and I still think they are the same owners and decision makers we have always had, but there is zero point debating that anymore

As we have finally achieved some decent selling, I'm still pondering whether this summer was that much different from a Levy summer in terms of net spending. It's a different way to skin a cat but is it any more risky that what the previous regime managed from a balance sheet and P&L perspective?

Don't disagree with your player choices. I still think that Romero, VDV, Danso, Phillips, Viuskovic isn't any worse than we ended up with. Arguably better. I'm happy with the Vic sacrifice whilst I'm OK with the midfield additions whilst feeling a little sad to lose Sarr. As for up front, I would have been OK keeping Lanks involved, at the sacrifice of Richi. Happy with the punt on the newbie forwards.

As for you last paragraph, football DNA is incredibly important. Levy lacked it and I doubt the new guys rolling in from the States have any more than him. In this situation, it's possible / probably that we have over rotated and tried to be great owners and let the biggest football DNA i.e. Roberto, have too much say without a competing voice.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

As for you last paragraph, football DNA is incredibly important. Levy lacked it and I doubt the new guys rolling in from the States have any more than him. In this situation, it's possible / probably that we have over rotated and tried to be great owners and let the biggest football DNA i.e. Roberto, have too much say without a competing voice.

Couple of my mates think Roberto is a donk, personally I don't, I actually like the guy and think he has something about him, but they make compelling arguments on why they would not have necessarily given him the keys to the castle. I am happy to wait and see, but equally I think we all have a right to call things we see happening along the way

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Its a long and I suspect futile answer to give because It will likely be met with matter of fact responses. But I will give you the short, I would not have swapped out Vusko for JPVH, I certainly would not have paid 75m for Savio, I would not freeze out Richy (he would not be at the club) and I would have had another Striker in (rather than all the CB deals) and I certainly would not have run the RB injury gauntlet.

And to be clear, I personally think there are fine lines between backing a manager, overpaying drastically to do so and being serious, I think its much more nuanced than just the money spent as I do the success of the window (as I have said often).

Anyway only time will tell if all we are doing as a club is the step up from the previous "regime" that some claim, for me there are the same red flags and I still think they are the same owners and decision makers we have always had, but there is zero point debating that anymore

Fair enough, I certainly respect that you would have done different things and I can see the arguments for them. Where I land is that if the owners and VV had a view of ‘we are going to back the manager’ then they did all they could. They held up their end of the bargain so to speak. Whether or not it works is in the gift of the gods, but I’m glad they did what they did.

I also think there’s a fair argument that maybe so much change at once has made this start of the season harder. So maybe it could have been phased differently. Equally, if you felt the club needed a psychological reset after the last couple of years and so then endeavoured to move anyone out who did not want to be here, I can see why they did it that way. I just hope we can get over this tough period.

 

[DTA]

We would have ended up with De Zerbi’s 3rd or 4th or 17th choice rather than his first or second choice.

Maybe, but his first choices look pants. So maybe his 4th option would have been better.

 

[Baleforce]

Ok, it’s not just the manager, there’s a whole team around. Agreed. But what more would you realistically have wanted our owners to do this summer? I think you have to say that at a minimum they have done their job. And now it’s on the players and staff to deliver.

Realistically, I want them to make the squad better, they have made it worse in almost every position.

 

[Lemonade Money]

It is quite funny reading this, a select few hyping themselves up into believing we are on the cusp of financial ruin because Levy isn't here

Net spend is in line with previous, all they've done is increase the wage bill to closer what a club with our turnover should be operating at and are still operating at a healthy ratio.

How dare they back a manager with his targets - if only Levy was here we wouldn't get our 'pants pulled down' signing the likes of Solanke, NDombele and Richarlison for 60 odd million each plus signing many average players for more than they're actually worth. Oh wait....

Is net spend in line with previous? This time we are taking loans out on our future. Can't remember Levy doing that. That's like saying we've always spent that amount on our investments, but instead of shares, we've spent it on the lottery.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Maybe, but his first choices look pants. So maybe his 4th option would have been better.

Not a great sample size so far. Would we really want to be in the situation again where we get the likes of Njie and Sissoko instead of Mane and Wijnaldum? I must say it’s quite comical seeing the contrast between the level of patience shown to Levy (25 years) even though we went backward for most of the last 6-7 years, including a 17th place finish which often gets ignored, whilst the new guys are dead men walking just over a year after taking over.

 

[afsoc4life]

Grew our profile and ultimately reached a ceiling which resulted in 6-7 years of decline before Levy eventually left. It’s not like we were top of the league when Levy was sacked or even top 6. We weren’t even in the top half!

There doesn't seem to be any semblance of serious strategy to the purchases recently made. See Emirates Marketing Project below. There seems to be limited understanding of the players we really need. Last season we were screaming for a proper finisher. We are still screaming for one!!

Manchester City transfer news: Squad overhaul from a 650,000-strong database

BBC Sport goes inside Emirates Marketing Project's data team, who have been a key part of their rebuild over the past 18 months.

www.bbc.com

Yes there was decline in the final year but you could argue that the focus was to ensure that the title hoodoo was broken. We have gone from that to absolutely scattergun pants.

 

[Jurgen the German]

There doesn't seem to be any semblance of serious strategy to the purchases recently made. See Emirates Marketing Project below. There seems to be limited understanding of the players we really need. Last season we were screaming for a proper finisher. We are still screaming for one!!

Manchester City transfer news: Squad overhaul from a 650,000-strong database

BBC Sport goes inside Emirates Marketing Project's data team, who have been a key part of their rebuild over the past 18 months.

www.bbc.com

Yes there was decline in the final year but you could argue that the focus was to ensure that the title hoodoo was broken. We have gone from that to absolutely scattergun pants.

And for most seasons before that. Just one top 4 finish which they club hierarchy covets more than anything else since 2019.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

And for most seasons before that. Just one top 4 finish which they club hierarchy covets more than anything else since 2019.

And a European Cup

Which is funny because after 20 years of people claiming that cups were all that mattered, last week the same people claimed that being knocked out the LC and being in the bottom three didn't matter.

I get being angry about Levy and then being all in on the "new" owners, but pick a lane and be consistent in your anger

 

[Jurgen the German]

And a European Cup

Which is funny because after 20 years of people claiming that cups were all that mattered, last week the same people claimed that being knocked out the LC and being in the bottom three didn't matter.

I get being angry about Levy and then being all in on the "new" owners, but pick a lane and be consistent in your anger

…which was the first trophy in 18 years. We need trophies and strong league finishes—it shouldn’t be one or the other.

I’d certainly never argue that being knocked out of a cup doesn’t matter. I can probably take a guess which poster feels that way about the cups, though.

I’m also not “all in” on the new owners or the people running the football operation, but I think they probably deserve more than a year before we start drawing definitive conclusions—especially when Levy had 25 years and, apparently, even that wasn’t enough time.

The other day you said you hadn’t seen people getting nervous about our spending. Are you still not seeing it now?