The 'If You Still Need to Purge Yourself Of Ange' Thread

[tommysvr]

Will always go down as quite a weird and absolutely a risky decision to let a trophy winning manager who hasn’t lost the dressing room go. We’ll see how it goes with Frank but there’s a big part of me that thinks Season 3 would have been a riot.

The reason many wanted rid of him was because "if we started badly it would just be a waste of the first few months."

Really glad that hasn't turned out to be the case.

 

[Gutter Boy]

The reason many wanted rid of him was because "if we started badly it would just be a waste of the first few months."

Really glad that hasn't turned out to be the case.

We're more than halfway to 42 points already and not yet halfway through our fixtures. That's progress on where we would have been.

 

[Baleforce]

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Never even heard of them.






Say the fans of Jeonbuk

 

[Lemonade Money]

I think it's pretty clear which players are not onboard right now. Yes, season 3 would've been a riot, I agree. Having gone through all that hardship and pain to STILL win a major trophy, I mean, culturally that squad would've been at a revving point.


Sadly though they'd made the decision a while back to change; that's the truth. The bit I cannot figure out is the 2 week delay in the summer, and I am guessing a large part of that comes down to Levy second-guessing himself and trying to get a quorum to agree to backtrack. It would be classic Daniel, he has form for that sort of thing...

My biggest bugbear, is we finally found a manager who could get us over the line. isn't that what we've been looking for? Couldn't we have nurtured that, and said you need better coaches?

 

[Robspur12]

Will always go down as quite a weird and absolutely a risky decision to let a trophy winning manager who hasn’t lost the dressing room go. We’ll see how it goes with Frank but there’s a big part of me that thinks Season 3 would have been a riot.

Worth reading all of VDV’s interview not just the first part where he praises Ange. Also said the following:-

Although he enjoyed Postecoglou's style of play, Netherlands international Van de Ven believes Tottenham lacked a "plan B" and revealed he and Cristian Romero discussed taking a more defensive approach with the manager.

"I liked the offensive play [under Postecoglou] but I like what we have now with Thomas Frank. We are more secure at the back. I don't like getting exposed every game on the counter-attack," he said.

"At the beginning [under Postecoglou], no team was used to playing against our system. We were playing unbelievable football.

"But managers analyse everything and people knew what we were doing. Sometimes we didn't really have a plan B and we were getting exposed. We didn't have solutions to get out.

"At one point [me and Romero] walked up to the gaffer and said we need to change some things and play more defensive to make sure we win those games. He was like I agree with you but I expect you two guys to sort this on the pitch, make sure everybody knows."

That explains in a nutshell what Ange’s problem was in the PL in his second season ( and possibly why he failed to register a win when he was boss at Forest) - managers and coaches in the PL analyse everything. His system got found out and he then struggled in the PL. I don’t subscribe to the view that his third season would have been a “riot.” I think it would very likely have mirrored what happened at Forest.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Worth reading all of VDV’s interview not just the first part where he praises Ange. Also said the following:-

Although he enjoyed Postecoglou's style of play, Netherlands international Van de Ven believes Tottenham lacked a "plan B" and revealed he and Cristian Romero discussed taking a more defensive approach with the manager.

"I liked the offensive play [under Postecoglou] but I like what we have now with Thomas Frank. We are more secure at the back. I don't like getting exposed every game on the counter-attack," he said.

"At the beginning [under Postecoglou], no team was used to playing against our system. We were playing unbelievable football.

"But managers analyse everything and people knew what we were doing. Sometimes we didn't really have a plan B and we were getting exposed. We didn't have solutions to get out.

"At one point [me and Romero] walked up to the gaffer and said we need to change some things and play more defensive to make sure we win those games. He was like I agree with you but I expect you two guys to sort this on the pitch, make sure everybody knows."

That explains in a nutshell what Ange’s problem was in the PL in his second season ( and possibly why he failed to register a win when he was boss at Forest) - managers and coaches in the PL analyse everything. His system got found out and he then struggled in the PL. I don’t subscribe to the view that his third season would have been a “riot.” I think it would very likely have mirrored what happened at Forest.

I understand the quotes, but two things:

1. He actually did adapt. He listened to his players. Plenty of top level managers have listened to their players feedback and ended up successful.

2. I think there’s a fair chance, which is alluded to in the other Micky quotes that you didn’t share, that with more first choice players playing more often, it would have been better. I’m never denying that Ange was all about getting one thing to work, and I’ve always argued that it simply was never going to work with so players out, so it was simply about managing through. He did manage through, and we won something. But the whole point, that we never really saw, was to see how a deep and fit Ange squad properly playing his football would look.

That’s always the bargain with system managers. Yes, if you don’t have the players to play it, other teams will pick apart the weaknesses. But if you do have the players to play it; because you’ve made strategic choices to sign certain types of players and want to play them a certain type of way compared to other clubs, that it can actually be a big strategic advantage.

We just never saw what it would look like with a deep and fit squad.

 

[thfcsteff]

We're more than halfway to 42 points already and not yet halfway through our fixtures. That's progress on where we would have been.

Nope, that's just conjecture you're presenting as 'truth'. You can believe it would've happened but it is without any evidence.