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Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

Bullet said:
Matt Wells said something like they flew home after the Gala game and landed at 2am on Friday 8th and went straight to the hotel in the training ground for a few hours sleep, then out onto the training pitches to do a mix of warming down and stretching for those who played, and warming up for those that didn't play.
Then Saturday 9th they talked to the team about what to expect from Ipswich, then Sunday 10th was the match. A very tough turnaround.
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It's an interesting choice by Spurs. You're arriving at 2am, but your body is telling you it's 5am from your destination.

The alternative is be tucked up in bed locally by midnight after the match. Then get up, have breakfast and take the 4 1/2 hour flight home, being back in the UK only 90min later on the GMT clock. Plenty of time left to stretch after the flight, eat and either stay at The Lodge or get back to families. Early night.

I'm sure the football clubs know what they're doing though. There must be a reason to have those guys on the late, late flights.
 
Muttley said:
It's an interesting choice by Spurs. You're arriving at 2am, but your body is telling you it's 5am from your destination.

The alternative is be tucked up in bed locally by midnight after the match. Then get up, have breakfast and take the 4 1/2 hour flight home, being back in the UK only 90min later on the GMT clock. Plenty of time left to stretch after the flight, eat and either stay at The Lodge or get back to families. Early night.

I'm sure the football clubs know what they're doing though. There must be a reason to have those guys on the late, late flights.
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Adrenalin may be a factor
Why not travel when they may not be able to sleep well
I really don’t know of course having never done it
But as you say, you should assume they know a thing or two about it
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Adrenalin may be a factor
Why not travel when they may not be able to sleep well
I really don’t know of course having never done it
But as you say, you should assume they know a thing or two about it
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I think you might be right. I've done loads of business travel but don't do any nowadays. You're always planning to the lowest common denominator. I used to be able to sleep on planes no worries. Other work colleagues didn't get a wink on 11 flights back the US. There will be some players like that and the club will need to factor in how wired they all get. Some will take it in their stride. Others won't.

You're a musician as well from memory. Trying to sleep too quickly after gigs can be tough for some. Same thing.
 
Muttley said:
I think you might be right. I've done loads of business travel but don't do any nowadays. You're always planning to the lowest common denominator. I used to be able to sleep on planes no worries. Other work colleagues didn't get a wink on 11 flights back the US. There will be some players like that and the club will need to factor in how wired they all get. Some will take it in their stride. Others won't.

You're a musician as well from memory. Trying to sleep too quickly after gigs can be tough for some. Same thing.
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I travel loads and never sleep on planes
My wife can sleep standing up
Yeah after a decent gig (haven’t dine one in ten years mind) the high is just that
We used to just get tinkled
Biggest issue I have now is when I’ve been to a gig that’s give me that rush, getting to sleep after can be a killer
Also driving home after a late match because the focus on the driving means you don’t switch off
 
DaveT316 said:
@thfcsteff - just keen to understand what you mean that you hope the manager is ‘properly’ or ‘fully’ supported. I’d be genuinely interested in your definition of these here.
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Absolutely mate.
If he asks for one or two specific players, I hope he gets them.
It is clear he wanted Solanke, so great.
Despite the doubt around it, I have it oin good authority he wanted Eze. We didn't get him.
He wanted Gallagher. He didn't get him.
He was reportedly very keen on Neto. We didn't get him.
Personally, I don't care for Neto and Gallagher is take or leave for me too, but I'm not Ange and he wanted them.

I absolutely appreciate that you cannot always have your favoured player for a position, and that in the past he has had his way (Van De Ven over Tapsoba being a good example).
What I am hoping for is that we at least are looking to balance out top tier deliveries versus options off a list deliveries. Again, I am not naiove to the way football works, and even the closest deal gets pulled last second. To that end, I remember Willian who was getting pur physical when his agent basically tried to squeeze more from us and he was told to do one; I think that is the right thing to do at that moment. Equally, when Poch wanted Grealish, and when we had Grealish done, just do the deal rather than tinkle about for a few quid.

As has been stated by others mate, no-one knows every detail and we all rely on scraps of information (I read little on social media about this stuff). Which is why I place these thoughts in conversational conjecture.

I think Ange is close to establishing who he can trust 100% of the time and who he cannot. I think he will surprise people with who he doesn't trust/wants to sell, and I hope that whatever that looks like, we trust him, back him on that, and buy the appropriate replacements. I thibnk even 2 out 4 top tier would be acceptable. This is, of course, if we as a football club want to give him and his plan the tenure and time it deserves. Which I think we should.

Hope all is well mate.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Adrenalin may be a factor
Why not travel when they may not be able to sleep well
I really don’t know of course having never done it
But as you say, you should assume they know a thing or two about it
Click to expand...

In my line there's lots of travel like this. Post-event, the main thing they will want to do is get back to 'home base' as soon as possible. Adrenaline will have something to do with that, also the concept of waking up and not having to 'go again'. I think the interesting bit is what the club do prep-wise on that arrival day. If you land at 1 o2 2am, you're not getting to sleep until 4 or 5. The player hotel is outstanding BTW, just off the hook luxury, so that is a decent option, but I'd love to know what time that training session would start. Surely not before noon. And even that is only leaving you with at best 6 hours sleep.

I suspect the training program is developed through the year to accomodate these 'weeks' where the travel chops things up.
 
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Lilbaz said:
Our poor performances in the prem have coincided with playing after the europa game midweek.
Thurs to sun is a killer for us. Not just tiredness but minimal prep time.
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We better prepare ourselves for whatever is dished on Sunday then😀
 
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Muttley said:
I think you might be right. I've done loads of business travel but don't do any nowadays. You're always planning to the lowest common denominator. I used to be able to sleep on planes no worries. Other work colleagues didn't get a wink on 11 flights back the US. There will be some players like that and the club will need to factor in how wired they all get. Some will take it in their stride. Others won't.

You're a musician as well from memory. Trying to sleep too quickly after gigs can be tough for some. Same thing.
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It doesn't happen in my experience. I know no touring musician who leaves the venue and is in bed (for sleep) within anything less than 3 to 4 hours.
 
Raziel said:
Not luck

- City came out the blocks really hard (to be expected) but after the goal we managed the match (they had probably two good spells, first 12 minutes then a bit in 2nd half)
- Ange setup to expose their FBs, especially Decki on Gvardiol
- Our FBs did come in but didn't push up as much
- Maddison's heat map is super interesting, basically (first 20 minutes aside), he spent a lot of time offering a pass option in front of the LCB, part of a broader (in my opinion) view to ensure Dragusin wasn't pressured on the ball too much (he does look better at RCB than LCB)
- A lot of City shots were rushed shots from edge/outside box.
- We pressed well and almost all the chances were from us wining the ball back off of them
- Son was used to pull a lot of City players out of position time and time again, created room for everyone else (and Son's passing was insane)
- All three subs contributed to final goal

Summary, we exposed their weaknesses (in midfield and at FB), covered ours (Dragusin & Davies), everyone worked their nuts off and we actually could have scored more (Solanke had a good chance, Edison had two good saves, one against a classic Son curler, one in 2nd half that was elite)

More importantly, City (x2), United, Villa show Ange's system can work at top level.
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Yes yes and yes.
 
thfcsteff said:
Absolutely mate.
If he asks for one or two specific players, I hope he gets them.
It is clear he wanted Solanke, so great.
Despite the doubt around it, I have it oin good authority he wanted Eze. We didn't get him.
He wanted Gallagher. He didn't get him.
He was reportedly very keen on Neto. We didn't get him.
Personally, I don't care for Neto and Gallagher is take or leave for me too, but I'm not Ange and he wanted them.

I absolutely appreciate that you cannot always have your favoured player for a position, and that in the past he has had his way (Van De Ven over Tapsoba being a good example).
What I am hoping for is that we at least are looking to balance out top tier deliveries versus options off a list deliveries. Again, I am not naiove to the way football works, and even the closest deal gets pulled last second. To that end, I remember Willian who was getting pur physical when his agent basically tried to squeeze more from us and he was told to do one; I think that is the right thing to do at that moment. Equally, when Poch wanted Grealish, and when we had Grealish done, just do the deal rather than tinkle about for a few quid.

As has been stated by others mate, no-one knows every detail and we all rely on scraps of information (I read little on social media about this stuff). Which is why I place these thoughts in conversational conjecture.

I think Ange is close to establishing who he can trust 100% of the time and who he cannot. I think he will surprise people with who he doesn't trust/wants to sell, and I hope that whatever that looks like, we trust him, back him on that, and buy the appropriate replacements. I thibnk even 2 out 4 top tier would be acceptable. This is, of course, if we as a football club want to give him and his plan the tenure and time it deserves. Which I think we should.

Hope all is well mate.
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Thanks for the detailed response mate, that’s all very clear. It’s sparked off some other thinking I’ve had about the make up of the current squad.

Eze is an interesting one as I’m just not sure where I see him in an Ange first XI, as I’d see him competing with Deki for that spot in the middle and I don’t see him as the prototypical Ange WF. I guess he could offer something different from what we have currently that is the ability to beat a man from a standing start, but he plays to a larger issue of how we approach squad building.

Conventional wisdom - not aimed at you pal! - says you simply have two great players for each position. However, there are two points I’d make here 1) that only works when you’re successful enough to keep two players of equal billing happy with spells out of the team 2) it doesn’t factor in succession planning - I.e. enough age profile difference built in so we don’t have people peaking at the same time and therefore have to potentially replace two people at once and consistently have to ‘painfully’ rebuild.

While the age profile of our current squad feels like a nice spread of ages from 18-32, I think we need to be digging deeper into it on a position by position basis. I’d said CBs are where we’ve done this well - Romero (Dragusin) and VdV (Davies) feel like a good balance of age, experience and expectation of playing time. The forward line, for me, is a mess - Solanke (Richy) same age, Son (Moore, Odobert too young), Johnson (no real cover bar Deki).

Anyway, I’m rambling now, but it just says to me we have a way to go before we have the optimal squad for Ange. It’s a personal take and one I’m not sure all will agree with.

Thanks again for your answer - I’ve been meaning to ask you on this for a while. My maths tells me you feel Ange was short this summer on who he wanted by one or two?
 
thfcsteff said:
In my line there's lots of travel like this. Post-event, the main thing they will want to do is get back to 'home base' as soon as possible. Adrenaline will have something to do with that, also the concept of waking up and not having to 'go again'. I think the interesting bit is what the club do prep-wise on that arrival day. If you land at 1 o2 2am, you're not getting to sleep until 4 or 5. The player hotel is outstanding BTW, just off the hook luxury, so that is a decent option, but I'd love to know what time that training session would start. Surely not before noon. And even that is only leaving you with at best 6 hours sleep.

I suspect the training program is developed through the year to accomodate these 'weeks' where the travel chops things up.
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The Lodge is a home from home for these guys. My understanding is that they all have their own suites and have personalised them to get that feeling of their own space. Can't imagine how many days in a year they spend there, but I bet it feels nothing like a hotel room to them. In some ways, the single guys might even prefer it.

I've always thought that a tour of The Lodge and doing a day in the life of a Spurs player's training day would be amazing. They spend a huge chunk of their lives there.
 
Muttley said:
The Lodge is a home from home for these guys. My understanding is that they all have their own suites and have personalised them to get that feeling of their own space. Can't imagine how many days in a year they spend there, but I bet it feels nothing like a hotel room to them. In some ways, the single guys might even prefer it.

I've always thought that a tour of The Lodge and doing a day in the life of a Spurs player's training day would be amazing. They spend a huge chunk of their lives there.
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Isn't The Lodge the old training ground, and Hotspur Way is the new?
 
Raziel said:
5 shots on goal (we had 7 for perspective), they had 24 total, hence the xG, 0.9xG per shot, ours was 0.28 per shot
Their best opportunities were from outside box and wide/angle, look how much more central ours were

View attachment 18106
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Bedfordspurs said:
Should they?
That is less that 0.1 per shot
That’s weak IMO and shows that we limited them to very little quality chances knowing they are the team that gives up the highest quality chances
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Doesn't the way xG is calculated mean that on average the team is expected to score that many goals from those chances. Discounting sample size issues from looking at a single game, but 10 0.1 xG chances will on average lead to a goal as often as two 0.5 xG chances I thought?
 
We won, they lost, we were better, much better IMO and clinical (thats a thing)........Happy days. Could not care one jot about XG and how lucky we were to get the cleansheet. Games reimagined or otherwise the weekends result has had me on cloud 9..............bring on more
 
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