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***Tottenham Hotspur v Charlton OMT***

Decent performance after the first half hour. Charlton’s B team weren’t up to much but we got through comfortably without really having to break sweat. We don’t always find these types of games easy.

A second home win in the calendar year is a confidence builder before Saturday, and goals for Moore and Savio will do them both a lot of good too.

Onwards and upwards!
 
Bishop said:
I wasn't talking about the goal, that wasn't his fault. The goal scorer span off LWB. I'm talking about the attack near the end where he just stood still and the attacker dribbled past him with ease, I see this happen all the time so it's not a fitness issue. He defends in the box very poorly and is consistent at doing that.
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I'll have to watch again but I am inclined to stick with my prognosis simply based on the fact you're calling him out as I know you are not a fan! You ARE taking man not ball on VdV, right?
 
Bishop said:
Overall pretty decent performance. We had to warm into it and probably needed Moore's goal to break the tension button e we got the first one you could see the flow begin.

Fernandes looks so classy, even playing slightly ahead of where I'd want to see him showed lots of nice touches and really pushes the ball into the right spaces at the right time. Moore really started to shine once he got his goal, and to be fair he was already really driving at his defender so his endeavour eventually paid off. Obviously nice to see Savio making and impact and scoring on his debut, that will help quieten the naysayers for a while but he has to continue that impact this weekend.
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I mean, only is reactionism and judgement is something people have a lust for...(in our club's case, perhaps!)...what I saw second-half was what De Zerbi wants to build...I'll save the rest for the Newcash OMT!
 
thfcsteff said:
I'll have to watch again but I am inclined to stick with my prognosis simply based on the fact you're calling him out as I know you are not a fan! You ARE taking man not ball on VdV, right?
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I don't really understand what you mean by taking the man. I've got no beef with with him, I'm just concerned about his defending, he just makes so many mistakes from positioning to decisions made when he's settled in the box.
 
Baleforce said:
damn right, Davies and Kinsky didn't waste their summer, Danso phoned it in, Porro was the only other messer
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Mate.
Never change.
From your epic avatar (one of the great philosophical moments in football and one that cemented Zizou's legend with me) to your stoic Barnstoneworth United attitude, I love ya!
 
Bishop said:
I don't really understand what you mean by taking the man. I've got no beef with with him, I'm just concerned about his defending, he just makes so many mistakes from positioning to decisions made when he's settled in the box.
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...my point was much more that until we see him in a properly-coached and prepared system with a settled defence around him, I would not be using history and the last minute of his first 25 mins this season as a stick to beat him with.

Let's face facts. Last season he was one of the players most crunched by a bricky manager who bluffed that he had us defensively tighter when he did not and flipped the entire system VdV was signed to play.

How about giving his class and quality some time.
 
thfcsteff said:
...my point was much more that until we see him in a properly-coached and prepared system with a settled defence around him, I would not be using history and the last minute of his first 25 mins this season as a stick to beat him with.

Let's face facts. Last season he was one of the players most crunched by a bricky manager who bluffed that he had us defensively tighter when he did not and flipped the entire system VdV was signed to play.

How about giving his class and quality some time.
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facts are, TF did, we were objectively better defensively, look at the xga stats alone (I mean, is there any other stat that matters, no there isn't), the average over the season was halved compared to the previous season
 
Baleforce said:
facts are, TF did, we were objectively better defensively, look at the xga stats alone (I mean, is there any other stat that matters, no there isn't), the average over the season was halved compared to the previous season
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I'll take it to PM as i'm into the chat but know others will groan at relitigation...did i mention I hate Mourinho hahahahahahah!!!!!!
 
thfcsteff said:
...my point was much more that until we see him in a properly-coached and prepared system with a settled defence around him, I would not be using history and the last minute of his first 25 mins this season as a stick to beat him with.

Let's face facts. Last season he was one of the players most crunched by a bricky manager who bluffed that he had us defensively tighter when he did not and flipped the entire system VdV was signed to play.

How about giving his class and quality some time.
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I do get that and he's a young defender with talent so there's nothing saying he can't learn, but my concerns date back to his first season with Ange...these mistakes have been there. RDZ hopefully will be the man to iron them out.
 
so this was the Charlton B team and it felt like a pre season match except for two incidents that drew blood (!) - danso and vdv - talk about freak accidents, was a shoulder fracture last time, what next /

for the most part that match looked quite equal - spurs getting a lot of time on the ball and not pressured much during build up play and it was good to see dezerbiball starting to click... and some glimpses of the attack finally getting its chance to properly transition into full fledged attack mode, something i'd not seen for a long long time from a spurs team !

however until moore's well taken solo goal, everything kinda hit a defensive brick wall - so it looked like we'd improved but hit our next wall. the changes after actually shifted the performance to the next level - vdv and danzo actually was the solid base to build more quickly from defence, gray, fernandez and luca playing higher added a lot more tempo to the middle, and of course savinho added that creative individual genius that we've not seen since Son.

a pity we could not keep a clean sheet - but i think it will be sorted once the starting CBs are sorted.

- moore's goal looked good but he needs a loan to further improve. even with charlton B he was failing to get any crosses through. he is 19 while savio is 22 so has time on his side, and that is a tangible target for him to work towards.
- tel is looking better with 1v1s and has better penetration and crossing than moore. also very good defensively coming back deeper and holding up the ball.
- solanke's half turns and fake turns was excellent, richy must have seen that and hated it knowing that he spurned his chances of staking a claim in the starting run up
- bergvall and gray looked comfortable - and great for their age - but i can't help but feel they need to develop a super-power to elevate them to the next level soon
- bentancur, porro, fernandez, savio - all ballers and they just know when to speed up or pass a ball with pace to initiate an attack or just attack space. there's something about "owning' the tempo of the game that is so satisfying to watch. fernandez and savio are very expensive but justified as we can aford it i guess.
- luca has very good movement, awareness and is fast. i personally feel he has a higher floor than moore already, and also higher ceiling. too bad he didn't have a chance to show off his dribbling but him and fernandez pressing together added some presence and pressure to force charlton to play quickly. i believe he is too young for a loan but i hope rdz keeps him in the men's team for direct development and integration

also kudos to rdz for getting the young ones a lot and managing the introductions of senior players. hopefully we will see a stronger starting line up this weekend - we will need it as Saudi Sportswashing Machine is already 100% fit and playing some very fast football already.
 
Thoughts on the game

Honestly training ground exercise, and that says a lot in itself. It showed one of the strength/weakness of RDZ ball, if someone tries to play us at that tempo, they won't hurt us, even the first 30 minutes that people complained about, we were just walking it.

On players
- Great goal from Moore, and his game went up a level after goal, but fudge he needs to work on his decision making.
- Vicario would have been crucified for that goal Kinsky let in, need to be better.
- Bergvall mixed bag as always, some good, some silly possession lost, made a lot of runs that players didn't leverage (Moore)
- Tel, typical first half struggle, sublime pass to Gray (I think) in box that should have resulted in a goal. Was ridiculously fouled in advertising board (we as a club really need to complain about this brick)
- Danso is fudging brave, guy just puts his body on line, instantly adds a better aerial presence for us.

- Fernandes, just a quality player, think we will laugh at that price tag in the future.
- Savio, well done to shut up everyone in first game, others have said a lot, what I would say is he instantly clicked with Porro (that's going to be interesting)
- Good to see Udogie get some time, very odd positioning, he played way more inside than I've ever seen, not sure the tactic.

Probably the game RDZ prayed for, nice, big win at home, good debuts, main striker getting a goal, expensive signings looking the part, time in the legs for Udogie, Porro, VDV, Savio.

Options starting to open, Udogie came off, VDV, Danso and Porro came on, Davies went LB, Gray went CM, could see with Kudus, Maddison, Marmoush, Savio, he will have lots of tactical tweaks available.

Suspect team on week-end will be -> Kinsky, Udogie, VDV, JPVH, Porro, Tonali, Bentancur, Fernandes, Tel, Solanke, Savio
 
Baleforce said:
yes, but it was the other wing that had more about it Saturday, and in pre season
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I don't care a out preseason at all, it means nothing. In terms of Saturday they were both poor but one wing had 3 chances on goal and should have scored at least 1, the other wing did nothing. Today that same wing scored and roasted his FB a number of times, again the other wing did nada (although he did have that one really good pass, so maybe not bad😅 but did fudge all otherwise to his FB).

I'm just saying maybe we should be rethinking Moore going out as right now he's been more effective than the backup starter we have on the left as it stands.

Once Kudus is back and Savio can go to the left then we can rethink but right now if consider keeping Moore as he's actually offering a goal threat despite all the gaps.
 
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Bishop said:
I don't care a out preseason at all, it means nothing. In terms of Saturday they were both poor but one wing had 3 chances on goal and should have scored at least 1, the other wing did nothing. Today that same wing scored and roasted his FB a number of times, again the other wing did nada (although he did have that one really good pass, so maybe not bad😅 but did fudge all otherwise to his FB).

I'm just saying maybe we should be rethinking Moore going out as right now he's been more effective than the backup starter we have on the left as it stands.

Once Kudus is back and Savio can go to the left then we can rethink but right now if consider keeping Moore as he's actually offering a goal threat despite all the gaps.
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I don’t think a game against a lower league reserve side means anything either.
 
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