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Tottenham Hotspur Stadium - Licence To Stand

Spurs7891 said:
Good to see us ready to move in to our new stadium. The Wembley curse has really stalled our progress since we left WHL. Hope the new stadium will help us progress and win trophies.

But just wondering, is there any reason why the capacity of the new stadium is put at 62,062, just 2,000 more than Arsenal stadium ? Is it due to cost involved or we can only fill around 62,062 fans in the stadium ? Being the newest stadium in the world, would have loved to have the capacity of around 80,000, more than ManU's 74,000 and closer to Wembley's 90,000 capacity. Other clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea, ManCity and Liverpool can easily expand their stadium and overtake our capacity in the near future.
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I was going to say "Now that is Spursey :rolleyes:" but I more inclined to think your the kind of knob that could suck the joy out of a bouncy-castle :mad:
 
Spurs7891 said:
Good to see us ready to move in to our new stadium. The Wembley curse has really stalled our progress since we left WHL. Hope the new stadium will help us progress and win trophies.

But just wondering, is there any reason why the capacity of the new stadium is put at 62,062, just 2,000 more than Arsenal stadium ? Is it due to cost involved or we can only fill around 62,062 fans in the stadium ? Being the newest stadium in the world, would have loved to have the capacity of around 80,000, more than ManU's 74,000 and closer to Wembley's 90,000 capacity. Other clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea, ManCity and Liverpool can easily expand their stadium and overtake our capacity in the near future.
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Can, yes. Easily no. Take arse as an example. For them to expand from 60k to 70k, would cost almost as much as the current stadium cost. It's just not worth it. It's not Financially viable.
And for Spurs, 60k is the right size. Too big, and there is no demand for tickets, which means you have to charge less.
 
Spurs7891 said:
Good to see us ready to move in to our new stadium. The Wembley curse has really stalled our progress since we left WHL. Hope the new stadium will help us progress and win trophies.

But just wondering, is there any reason why the capacity of the new stadium is put at 62,062, just 2,000 more than Arsenal stadium ? Is it due to cost involved or we can only fill around 62,062 fans in the stadium ? Being the newest stadium in the world, would have loved to have the capacity of around 80,000, more than ManU's 74,000 and closer to Wembley's 90,000 capacity. Other clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea, ManCity and Liverpool can easily expand their stadium and overtake our capacity in the near future.
Click to expand...

I think 62,000 is *presently* the upper limit of what we can reasonably expect in terms of attendances. As another poster here mentioned to me a while ago, it makes sense to build your stadium just under the expected attendance, in order to keep demand high. It was a good decision - hell, it remains a great decision, because I had honestly feared that we would go for an even lower number (56,000) which was the plan in the original build.

However, I did also wonder if we had built in any measures to increase capacity in the future. The big problem with WHL was that it was already snug at 36,000-ish in terms of footprint, and it required a new design to maximize attendances beyond a theoretical upper limit of 45,000-ish (which I believe was considered at one point). It was a hard constraint on our growth at the old place.

It would be good to not have to worry about hitting that upper limit in 15-20 years or so. However, I imagine it will be very difficult, if not impossible, given how tough it was just to build this custom-made behemoth in the narrow space available to us.

In the end, it's about what a natural 'resting' size a club of our stature should have, in terms of attendance. If football continues growing in popularity at the rate of the last three decades, then we may need to think about expansion again in the future. If it plateaus, then this will be a nice, ideal size to sit at. It's really a long-term planning thing, and you need a range of projections to determine what that outcome will be. Would be nice to have, though.


Kandi1977 said:
Can, yes. Easily no. Take arse as an example. For them to expand from 60k to 70k, would cost almost as much as the current stadium cost. It's just not worth it. It's not Financially viable.
And for Spurs, 60k is the right size. Too big, and there is no demand for tickets, which means you have to charge less.
Click to expand...

Agreed . But is there a provision to expand it in 20 or so years, or do you think it would be too tough/expensive for us to do?
 
Also, if you'll all indulge me for a moment.

We're playing like brick.

We have 1 point from 12, having lost to Burnley, Southampton and Chelsea.

It's uncertain whether we'll finish in the top four, or whether we'll return to being Europa League chancers once again.

Our players are tired, and we're broke. We haven't made a signing for 18 months.

Christian Eriksen and Toby Alderweireld look set to leave at the end of the season, and the era of this team is coming to an end - there will be a rebuild required this summer, come what may.

City will likely pump us in the Champions League quarter-final, and there are question marks around where we go from here.

But, two years ago, at the end of the 2016-2017 season...


....Mauricio Pochettino stood in the centre circle of the old White Hart Lane for the last time, tears in his eyes, as the old place echoed to the songs of old. For one last time.

'For the last time, Spurs go marching in to White Hart Lane.'

It's been a strange two years in exile.

A strange, topsy-turvy time, for the team, and for me. Playing in a ground that wasn't our own, bottling it, and yet not bottling it - moments of joy, of frustration, of ups and downs and all that comes with football.

And life - personally, I've had my ups, and my downs. I've been in places I don't want to dwell on, and I've lived with a feeling of despair that I would never fit in, never find a purpose...

..never find a home.


It's been a strange two years in exile.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1109877622828347392

https://twitter.com/x/status/1109853275594129409

https://twitter.com/x/status/1109951548489109504

But we're home.

Spurs are home. And I think, so am I. My life has changed, and I've found people, purpose and a place in life that I can call my own. It's small, but it's all I ever really asked for.

I'm going to visit that place one day. And I will do so knowing that, at long last....

Tottenham Hotspur are back home.

Whatever else happens, this season will be worth it for that alone.

Enjoy, folks. I wish you all the very best. Thanks for bearing with me all this time. And one day soon, I'll hopefully join you in this new cathedral of ours - a place to call our own. :)

47404489272_a9d5376f74_k.jpg
 
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Lots on twitter showing the singing in the Marketplace after yesterday’s game. I went straight home (well, that was the intention but network rail had other ideas) but think I will take a walk round to that section after Sarurday’s match. Atmosphere looks great.

And how fantastic would it be to hear a rendition of this around the ground?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1109910277426954241
 
DubaiSpur said:
I think 62,000 is *presently* the upper limit of what we can reasonably expect in terms of attendances. As another poster here mentioned to me a while ago, it makes sense to build your stadium just under the expected attendance, in order to keep demand high. It was a good decision - hell, it remains a great decision, because I had honestly feared that we would go for an even lower number (56,000) which was the plan in the original build.

However, I did also wonder if we had built in any measures to increase capacity in the future. The big problem with WHL was that it was already snug at 36,000-ish in terms of footprint, and it required a new design to maximize attendances beyond a theoretical upper limit of 45,000-ish (which I believe was considered at one point). It was a hard constraint on our growth at the old place.

It would be good to not have to worry about hitting that upper limit in 15-20 years or so. However, I imagine it will be very difficult, if not impossible, given how tough it was just to build this custom-made behemoth in the narrow space available to us.

In the end, it's about what a natural 'resting' size a club of our stature should have, in terms of attendance. If football continues growing in popularity at the rate of the last three decades, then we may need to think about expansion again in the future. If it plateaus, then this will be a nice, ideal size to sit at. It's really a long-term planning thing, and you need a range of projections to determine what that outcome will be. Would be nice to have, though.




Agreed . But is there a provision to expand it in 20 or so years, or do you think it would be too tough/expensive for us to do?
Click to expand...
Basically, if you want to expand capacity in the stadium, you have to build higher. To build higher, you also have to expand outwards, as stands can't be vertical.
We simply don't have space for it, and it will also be tremendously expensive, as this will also require a totally new roof and roof support design, and this for very little, if any, gain.

I can't see any expansion coming in the next 40 years.
It may be possible to fit in a couple of thousand extra seats, by rearranging the layout, but this will impact sight lines, so again, major work for little gain.
 
nayenezgani said:
It has? Our progress has been upward, even playing at Wembley. The notion of a curse is utter nonsense, much like the rest of your post.
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We were unbeaten at WHL and almost win the league in 2017. Since we moved to Wembley, our performances have been largely unconvincing. We lost 2 matches at Wembley last season and have already lost 4 matches so far this season.

Really thought we would make use of Wembley to win either the FA Cup or League Cup but instead we didn't even reach any final, even losing the FA Cup semi final and League Cup match last season. Playing at Wembley for 2 seasons has been a good experience for us but don't think it has helped us to progress in any way.
 
Kandi1977 said:
Basically, if you want to expand capacity in the stadium, you have to build higher. To build higher, you also have to expand outwards, as stands can't be vertical.
We simply don't have space for it, and it will also be tremendously expensive, as this will also require a totally new roof and roof support design, and this for very little, if any, gain.

I can't see any expansion coming in the next 40 years.
It may be possible to fit in a couple of thousand extra seats, by rearranging the layout, but this will impact sight lines, so again, major work for little gain.
Click to expand...

This is the thing you have to worry about. It will be too difficult, costly and disruptive to expand the stadium in the future. Being a London club with rich history and huge fan base, really think we should have a stadium capacity of around 80,000. Really annoyed that ManU have a huge stadium capacity which no other club can even come near which means they can always buy any players with their huge profit.
 
Spurs7891 said:
This is the thing you have to worry about. It will be too difficult, costly and disruptive to expand the stadium in the future. Being a London club with rich history and huge fan base, really think we should have a stadium capacity of around 80,000. Really annoyed that ManU have a huge stadium capacity which no other club can even come near which means they can always buy any players with their huge profit.
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Permenant safe standing if ever allowed could push the capacity up (where it doesn't have to be 1-2-1 with seats)
 
r-u-s-x said:
Permenant safe standing if ever allowed could push the capacity up (where it doesn't have to be 1-2-1 with seats)
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I was about to refer to that - namely that if as I expect will eventually be the case, they ratify safe standing, there's going to be scope for another 15-20% capacity at a rough estimate. That means potentially 74,000 in the stadium, and that would likely exceed our current demand calculations. Sooooo, then the club would very likely decide it would only invoke safe standing for "special" games - North London Derbies, etc, where the demand would exceed supply still.
 
I'm pretty sure they've said that safe standing would only ever mean one person standing to a seat? Which is probably right and safe to be honest.

You'd obviously hope that they've built it with the potential to increase the capacity, even slightly, in the future if necessary.

However, I think 62k is pretty much a perfect capacity for us. It increases the capacity by a lot and increases income streams but still maintains demand. If people aren't guaranteed tickets, they will buy season tickets, they will buy memberships. We would not fill 80k on a regular basis imo.

Also, if GHod forbid, we started going South rather than carrying on improving and we go back to being a Europa level club / even worse, we definitely would not fill more than 60k, unless we are creative with pricing.
 
Spurs7891 said:
We were unbeaten at WHL and almost win the league in 2017. Since we moved to Wembley, our performances have been largely unconvincing. We lost 2 matches at Wembley last season and have already lost 4 matches so far this season.

Really thought we would make use of Wembley to win either the FA Cup or League Cup but instead we didn't even reach any final, even losing the FA Cup semi final and League Cup match last season. Playing at Wembley for 2 seasons has been a good experience for us but don't think it has helped us to progress in any way.
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I suppose there are a number of different ways to measure “progress”, of which winning trophies is of course a key one. But not the only one (eg total points tally, how far we get in cup competitions etc) It also depends whether you are talking about year-on-year progression or taking a less short term view (eg - whilst not wanting to tempt fate - securing CL for yet another season would mean we are gradually becoming a consistent CL participant - consolidating that over a number of seasons is certainly progression).
You mention unconvincing performances at Wembley over the past two seasons, yet despite that we have, until recently, been doing pretty well. Another sign of progression of sorts? And our recent patch of bad results have been away, as were the games where we dropped out of the domestic cups.
I’m not sure how much playing at Wembley has been a good experience for anyone. It’s certainly one we could have done without, especially this season.
But we’re home now which is all that matters.

Spurs7891 said:
This is the thing you have to worry about. It will be too difficult, costly and disruptive to expand the stadium in the future. Being a London club with rich history and huge fan base, really think we should have a stadium capacity of around 80,000. Really annoyed that ManU have a huge stadium capacity which no other club can even come near which means they can always buy any players with their huge profit.
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We have a decent - and growing - fan base. Not sure it would be described as huge just yet (on a global basis).
Utd are a bit of an exceptional case really. A large factor in the size of Utd’s fan base was the Munich aircrash and the global attention that brought to the club at a time when they were enjoying a period of success in domestic football. It gave them a global platform to build on from a marketing perspective, which other teams did not have. (Not intended to sound callous or cynical, but it was a by-product of the tragedy). It’s not the size of their stadium per se that makes them profitable.

The demographics and habits of football fans are changing. Cost of attending can be expensive, tv and internet streaming have flung open the gates of accessibility.
A big stadium not filled does not look good and does not help profitability. Wet Spam can’t wait to have their capacity increased to 66k. But are they going to make huge profits on the back of that? Unlikely.
Time will tell but I think we (Levy) have most likely got the balance right between capacity, quality, and of course building a stadium that is somewhat future proofed by its multi-purpose nature.
 
to those that were there, I can't believe none of you made it a proper test event for the club by setting the fire alarms off to check the wiring, call yourselves fans?
 
Hootnow said:
I'm pretty sure they've said that safe standing would only ever mean one person standing to a seat? Which is probably right and safe to be honest.
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The one to one is political not safety, 1-2-1.6 (I think it was this ) is safe for a properly designed safe standing. It was also why I said permanent, there would be no seats.
 
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