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The slightly girly Health, Fitness & Diet Thread

Nice tactic to conflating my point with crystals ;). They have been using ketogenic diets as part of medical treatments for many years. I'm on safe ground. If you would like to argue against that practice with peer reviewed, appropriately scaled studies published in respected medical journals I'll happily change my mind.
It's been used to treat epilepsy.

I don't see any weight of opinion from qualified medical professionals (hint: that doesn't include nutritionists) that this works as a form of weight loss.
 
It's been used to treat epilepsy.

I don't see any weight of opinion from qualified medical professionals (hint: that doesn't include nutritionists) that this works as a form of weight loss.
There are others too that you have omitted which you can find easily enough (thanks for all the hints btw).
 
There are others too that you have omitted which you can find easily enough (thanks for all the hints btw).

I've been looking and haven't been able to find anything that suggests it performs better than any other diet for long term weight loss. I have found quite a lot about the risks of a high fat diet.
 
I've been looking and haven't been able to find anything that suggests it performs better than any other diet for long term weight loss. I have found quite a lot about the risks of a high fat diet.
I don't think it is. Quite the opposite as far as I can see. It is effective for a short term dramatic drop, which is maybe how it found its way into medical circles, but the advice is that it's not something you should do long term. Low fat diets are better in that regards.

Has anyone tried intermittent fasting?
 
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There are over 60 rcts listed in that link. Do have a look if you feel like it.


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Gladly.

First in that list from a recognised journal is no.2. In the words of the author(s) there were no discernible differences compared to a proper diet after one year. In my own words, looking at the data, those on the fad diet were slowing weight loss far more rapidly than those on the real diet. Any sensible projection past one year would assume a continuation of that trend. Back into the words of the author, the trial wasn't nearly good enough to measure the longer term trends (a familiar comment if you read enough of these).

No.3 was a 6 month study, which no.2 has proven to not be nearly long enough for a valid analysis.

No.7 doesn't even specify the length of the study or whether that length was established before the results started coming through. That just stinks of P hacking and I'm amazed it even got published.

17 includes those with diabetes (an important disqualifying factor if you're messing with people's insulin levels, right?) and references another study (can't remember the number in that list) which didn't even compare calorific intake between the two types of diet.

No 5 was for 12 weeks.

At this point I got bored of reading the same lack of evidence over and over. Did you actually read any of those studies or just link to a page full of them?

Not a single one that I could find was double blinded, none lasted for any length of time (the 2 year study didn't filter participants) except the one for one year that suggested the fad diet was no better and was showing worse long term trends than the real diet.

If you did read the articles, did you skip to the end and see who they were financed by? That doesn't negate the validity of the trials (the contents do that we'll enough). But the repetition of names leads me to feel that the claim of a single long-term, properly controlled trial being prohibitively expensive is weak, seeing as they can afford to pay for an entire fudgepile of poor studies.
 
The Mrs did a keto diet back in Nov/Dec. I'm actually quite impressed she lived on basically fruit and veg for all that time! Got back to the weight she wanted but man it seemed like a miserable way to live though lol. I can do whatever sport or fitness regime you wanna throw at me but I still have to eat whatever I feel like from time to time.
 
Gladly.

First in that list from a recognised journal is no.2. In the words of the author(s) there were no discernible differences compared to a proper diet after one year. In my own words, looking at the data, those on the fad diet were slowing weight loss far more rapidly than those on the real diet. Any sensible projection past one year would assume a continuation of that trend. Back into the words of the author, the trial wasn't nearly good enough to measure the longer term trends (a familiar comment if you read enough of these).

No.3 was a 6 month study, which no.2 has proven to not be nearly long enough for a valid analysis.

No.7 doesn't even specify the length of the study or whether that length was established before the results started coming through. That just stinks of P hacking and I'm amazed it even got published.

17 includes those with diabetes (an important disqualifying factor if you're messing with people's insulin levels, right?) and references another study (can't remember the number in that list) which didn't even compare calorific intake between the two types of diet.

No 5 was for 12 weeks.

At this point I got bored of reading the same lack of evidence over and over. Did you actually read any of those studies or just link to a page full of them?

Not a single one that I could find was double blinded, none lasted for any length of time (the 2 year study didn't filter participants) except the one for one year that suggested the fad diet was no better and was showing worse long term trends than the real diet.

If you did read the articles, did you skip to the end and see who they were financed by? That doesn't negate the validity of the trials (the contents do that we'll enough). But the repetition of names leads me to feel that the claim of a single long-term, properly controlled trial being prohibitively expensive is weak, seeing as they can afford to pay for an entire fudgepile of poor studies.

Fair enough. Thanks for your time. Perhaps my bias is more towards diabetes and in all clinical settings, patients have suffered substantial weight loss as a consequence of tight dietary control of carbohydrates.

As I said in my caveats, any type of nutrition RCT would have structure, time, monitoring and cost issues. All the huge studies with long periods are epidemiological and in mean my opinion fail to prove causality.

Good to have feedback from a sceptic. Thanks
 
The Mrs did a keto diet back in Nov/Dec. I'm actually quite impressed she lived on basically fruit and veg for all that time! Got back to the weight she wanted but man it seemed like a miserable way to live though lol. I can do whatever sport or fitness regime you wanna throw at me but I still have to eat whatever I feel like from time to time.
:) that is probably not a well formulated ketogenic diet. Where was the steak and eggs? :)
fruit and veg seems like some vegetarian thing...
 
I don't think it is. Quite the opposite as far as I can see. It is effective for a short term dramatic drop, which is maybe how it found its way into medical circles, but the advice is that it's not something you should do long term. Low fat diets are better in that regards.

Has anyone tried intermittent fasting?

I have on and off. Works best if you are fully fat-adapted before starting. i tend to binge so IF really helps in that regard. The most I would suggest is 18-24 hour window.
 
Does anyone take any pre-workout supplements or drinks for an energy boost before a workout? Ive been using pure caffeine pills but wondering if there is anything else?
 
How can saturated fats be healthy?

All research and admittedly my medical assessments we’re always told saturated fat will cause heart issues. Why would this be more healthy than a diet encompassing all food groups in moderation.
 
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