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The Immense Struggle to avoid the European Conference League

totalspurs said:
It's all hypothetical...but we weren't at any risk of Bankruptcy under Sugar, the Prem money had started. But if he hadn't sold to ENIC and if he waited for someone else to come in there is nothing to say we would have or wouldn't have been in the same position now.

ENIC didn't save us from financial troubles, they just ended the Sugar era which was frustrating for Spurs fans. It was Sugar/Tel who saved us from Bankruptcy.

My comments are purely in reference to people who imply we should be grateful to ENIC/Levy as we don't remember how life was before ENIC...as if ENIC were some great saviour.

ENIC are a business who purchased Spurs at a good time from business point of view. A sleeping giant who was stable financial but with the potential to become a massive investment with all the money coming in to Football.
Other businesses could have come in at any point over that 12-24 and done the same or better.

Judge ENIC on the football business they purchased, but do not make at that we owe them anything. It's all business for them and it should be how we should scrutinized them.
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You're stating that we don't know what would have happened with other owners, which is fair enough to an extent.
There are some comparisons, we can look at clubs of similar size that were around or above us at the time that ENIC took over, the like of Villa, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Leeds were above us and Everton not far behind us in the table.
None of them have progressed close to what we have under ENIC and Levy. They have all spent time outside the PL besides Everton who may go down this season and have financial issues.
We've built the best stadium by far in England and one of if not the best, training grounds while at the same time improving the team and going from a midtable team to one that is always in Europe and regularly in the CL.
None of the teams mentioned have achieved any of that and they have had more money pumped into them from outside investment than we have.
The only teams that have gone from where we were and done better are City and Chelsea and that is due to being the playthings of a nation or a gangster.
So judging against what every other club has done in that time frame it's fair to say that the odds are that we would be in a worse state if it wasn't ENIC buying us unless we got bought by a nation-state.
 
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DubSpur said:
You're stating that we don't know what would have happened with other owners with other owners, which is fair enough to an extent.
There are some comparisons, we can look at clubs of similar size that were around or above us at the time that ENIC took over, the like of Villa, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Leeds were above us and Everton not far behind us in the table.
None of them have progressed close to what we have under ENIC and Levy. They have all spent time outside the PL besides Everton who may go down this season and have financial issues.
We've built the best stadium by far in England and one of if not the best, training grounds while at the same time improving the team and going from a midtable team to one that is always in Europe and regularly in the CL.
None of the teams mentioned have achieved any of that and they have had more money pumped into them from outside investment than we have.
The only teams that have gone from where we were and done better are City and Chelsea and that is due to being the playthings of a nation or a gangster.
So judging against what every other club has done in that time frame it's fair to say that the odds are that we would be in a worse state if it wasn't ENIC buying us unless we got bought by a nation-state.
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As I said hypothetically speaking.

But at least you give a constructive argument and analysis. Fair point.
 
totalspurs said:
Are you saying no other investors could ever have taken over from Sugar and done the same or better than Levy?
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Look at comparable teams to us at the time and what their owners did over the same period and that should give you your answer. Heck, look at Leicester. They won a title and instead of building off that, they're now in financial trouble and fighting relegation.

So, outside of getting bought by a state or billionaire pre-FFP, we really lucked out with ENIC.
 
Well by this time tomorrow we will know our chance of a top 4 spot will be gone !!

I feel we need 7 points from Saudi Sportswashing Machine (a), United (h), Liverpool (a) to have any chance of a CL space

We're not getting 7, be lucky to get 3
 
markysimmo said:
Well by this time tomorrow we will know our chance of a top 4 spot will be gone !!

I feel we need 7 points from Saudi Sportswashing Machine (a), United (h), Liverpool (a) to have any chance of a CL space

We're not getting 7, be lucky to get 3
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I could see us beating Utd and getting a point in one of the away games. Too many problems (no creativity, no leadership, no confidence) to think we have a meaningful chance of getting much more than that
 
AdamB said:
I could see us beating Utd and getting a point in one of the away games. Too many problems (no creativity, no leadership, no confidence) to think we have a meaningful chance of getting much more than that
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The problem is, even if we do well against a team considered a 'big team' , all our matches, no matter who we play, are subject to a random score generator.
 
markysimmo said:
Well by this time tomorrow we will know our chance of a top 4 spot will be gone !!

I feel we need 7 points from Saudi Sportswashing Machine (a), United (h), Liverpool (a) to have any chance of a CL space

We're not getting 7, be lucky to get 3
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Forget CL we are in a battle to get EL.

Villa, Pool and Brighton are coming for us :eek:
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
Forget CL we are in a battle to get EL.

Villa, Pool and Brighton are coming for us :eek:
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Villa have to play United, Us, Liverpool and Brighton in their last 6. I thought the match at Anfield might be the 7th place decider, but have a feeling it could be the game at Villa Park. Have a feeling if we avoid defeat in that game we finish 7th, lose and it's 8th
 
paxtonwolf said:
Villa have to play United, Us, Liverpool and Brighton in their last 6. I thought the match at Anfield might be the 7th place decider, but have a feeling it could be the game at Villa Park. Have a feeling if we avoid defeat in that game we finish 7th, lose and it's 8th
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7th will likely be conference league
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
Watching the last 8 tie in Seville the other night makes it hard to see how something like that is not worth it?
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I get that, though then you add in the effort which Sevilla/Man U would have put in to that tie before a league game less than 72 hours later.

Arguments which have been done to death before, and given that its still highly debated probably shows that its a fine balance
 
AdamB said:
I get that, though then you add in the effort which Sevilla/Man U would have put in to that tie before a league game less than 72 hours later.

Arguments which have been done to death before, and given that its still highly debated probably shows that its a fine balance
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I get the pragmatic pluses and minuses for being in it or not...I was more commenting from the whole occasion angle, buzzing night under the lights. Thrilling stuff.

But our European neighbours certainly have a different attitude towards it compared to our indifferent approach (and I'll admit, that has included me)
 
So much for that then. If Brighton don't win today, I think top 4 is settled.

Credit to Eddie Howe. Made the most of his signings, got the team playing good football. Based on performances throughout this season, they deserve it.
 
FatBloke said:
So much for that then. If Brighton don't win today, I think top 4 is settled.

Credit to Eddie Howe. Made the most of his signings, got the team playing good football. Based on performances throughout this season, they deserve it.
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Brighton winning doesn't make a difference, going out of the cup isn't going to impact Utd in the league
 
Wouldn't make a difference anyway - we're toast and I'd be surprised if we pick up another point
 
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