Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[scaramanga]

I think anyone has the right to say anything....it's where the line is drawn, that's the neverending discussion.

But you just said that anyone has the right to say anything. That opinion isn't compatible with there being any kind of line.

 

[scaramanga]

"Anti-capitalist views" is already listed as something to report as radicalisation in Theresa May's Prevent programme

Or maybe they're just collecting data so they know how many spaces they need on the short buses.

 

[thfcsteff]

But you just said that anyone has the right to say anything. That opinion isn't compatible with there being any kind of line.

I think the line is that when something is said which deliberately harms, offends, or causes aggressive physical situations, then it is beyond the realms of free speech.

I think the biggest issue has been the measure of what THAT all is. And to that degree, there has been an ultimately dangerous 'over-correction' which has now seen a pendulum swing back. Humour has suffered hugely, and a lot of what I would call average folk ended up being sucked into 'defending' themselves simply because they didn't 'proclaim' an issue. Social media has manipulated us into a society wildly divided, with architects on all sides 'benefitting' from sewing such seeds. I think it is tragic and dangerous, again on all sides. People are unfairly written off as 'fascists' just like people are unfairly written off as 'lefties' and both just become reactions to each other.

My biggest concern is that the whole idea and philosophy of responsible free speech is at a tipping point simply because no middle ground, or dialectic discussion, exists.

 

[scaramanga]

I think the line is that when something is said which deliberately harms, offends, or causes aggressive physical situations, then it is beyond the realms of free speech.

I think the biggest issue has been the measure of what THAT all is. And to that degree, there has been an ultimately dangerous 'over-correction' which has now seen a pendulum swing back. Humour has suffered hugely, and a lot of what I would call average folk ended up being sucked into 'defending' themselves simply because they didn't 'proclaim' an issue. Social media has manipulated us into a society wildly divided, with architects on all sides 'benefitting' from sewing such seeds. I think it is tragic and dangerous, again on all sides. People are unfairly written off as 'fascists' just like people are unfairly written off as 'lefties' and both just become reactions to each other.

My biggest concern is that the whole idea and philosophy of responsible free speech is at a tipping point simply because no middle ground, or dialectic discussion, exists.

That can't work either.

We can't use being offended as a measure, otherwise anyone can claim offence to silence anyone they want - see Islamists and blasphemy laws.

We can't use harm as a measure because words can't harm. They don't have a real, physical entity with which to do so.

We already have laws to deal with words that lead to actual, physical harm. We don't need to constrain free speech to use them.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

So the prime minister says that it was a top priority of his government to get a man released who called for the death of police officers and says he hates white people.

No issue with that then gents?

Hmm ideology comes before what's right with you guys I guess.

 

[thfcsteff]

That can't work either.

We can't use being offended as a measure, otherwise anyone can claim offence to silence anyone they want - see Islamists and blasphemy laws.

We can't use harm as a measure because words can't harm. They don't have a real, physical entity with which to do so.

We already have laws to deal with words that lead to actual, physical harm. We don't need to constrain free speech to use them.

Yes, and I am assuming you read beyond my first line? Just in case, I agree that it is no longer workable as a standard. Thanks to both 'sides' of the spectrum, each having 'agitators' who amplify/denigrate/conflate and mis-state to suit their own agendas.