• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

Gutter Boy said:
What more is there to talk about, now it has succeeded completely? Northern Ireland protocol is of interest to a few hundred thousand DUP voters, but not really anyone else.

Now we are free to choose whatever path we want. If Labour propose nationalisation programmes in future elections, they will actually be able to implement them now. And the same with any other proposals that were previously prevented by EU competition laws.

I still don't get this view that we somehow live in a presidential system. Your local MP and the manifesto they are standing against are the only things anyone ever gets to vote for. And thank fudge for that. Imagine the even greater harm President Johnson or President Blair might have caused without some of our parliamentary restraints and checks.
Click to expand...

Put it this way, if Brexit had been a roaring success, posters who now wish to ignore Brexit would have been here flagging up its successes no?

It is not a "view". The simple reality is, 160,000 old people will have chosen our PM twice in about 5-6 years. If that is democracy in action, @Lost Mango is spot on, the system needs reform.

The subtext and history of where we are now is the Tory party and its own internal European divide which it has let spill out into the country. The shabby cabinet of incompetent MPs has been driven by Brexit, the election of Johnson, May and now this latest incumbent, they all relate to dealing with Brexit. On top of that we have financial realities relating to Brexit, NI, and hell...we supposedly have opportunities because of Brexit. Wasn't someone supposed to realise them!?

No lets just forget the sorry thing happened at all! If that is the sentiment we'd be better off re-joining the single market and getting on with it. Why prolong the pain.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Put it this way, if Brexit had been a roaring success, posters who now wish to ignore Brexit would have been here flagging up its successes no?

It is not a "view". The simple reality is, 160,000 old people will have chosen our PM twice in about 5-6 years. If that is democracy in action, @Lost Mango is spot on, the system needs reform.

The subtext and history of where we are now is the Tory party and its own internal European divide which it has let spill out into the country. The shabby cabinet of incompetent MPs has been driven by Brexit, the election of Johnson, May and now this latest incumbent, they all relate to dealing with Brexit. On top of that we have financial realities relating to Brexit, NI, and hell...we supposedly have opportunities because of Brexit. Wasn't someone supposed to realise them!?

No lets just forget the sorry thing happened at all! If that is the sentiment we'd be better off re-joining the single market and getting on with it. Why prolong the pain.
Click to expand...

Did people keep talking about abolition or votes for women years after they'd happened? Or did conversation just move onto the next challenges? I don't know.

Democracy works fine in our system. PM isn't an important role - it's first amongst equals, not as elevated a position as the media tries to portray it. People voted for a disrupter government because that's what we needed in 2019. Now we need something a more stable and compassionate, and that will happen next election.
 
Gutter Boy said:
Did people keep talking about abolition or votes for women years after they'd happened? Or did conversation just move onto the next challenges? I don't know.

Democracy works fine in our system. PM isn't an important role - it's first amongst equals, not as elevated a position as the media tries to portray it. People voted for a disrupter government because that's what we needed in 2019. Now we need something a more stable and compassionate, and that will happen next election.
Click to expand...
Rare we agree on politics - but spot on analysis.
 
Gutter Boy said:
Did people keep talking about abolition or votes for women years after they'd happened? Or did conversation just move onto the next challenges? I don't know.

Democracy works fine in our system. PM isn't an important role - it's first amongst equals, not as elevated a position as the media tries to portray it. People voted for a disrupter government because that's what we needed in 2019. Now we need something a more stable and compassionate, and that will happen next election.
Click to expand...

The fundamental difference is women's suffrage, once implemented, was easy and worked. Brexit still has many todos as outlined in the previous post. We are in dispute with the EU re. Brexit. We have a border in the Irish sea which divides our nation and creates all sorts of trade and peace challenges. Our trade is also being impacted and we need to realise trade away from the EU, or open things up so we can trade with the EU freely again. We have less tax revenue because of Brexit and have to adjust to this reality. And those are just the big ticket items. There are myriad other smaller issues: our academics can't access EU funding or collaborate so easily, pet passport costs, phone roaming costs, visa issues, farmer exports and subsidies, lack of workers for our businesses etc etc etc All things you'd expect a government to look at and address.

To compare something that was a great success - giving women the vote - to something that has been a veritable shambles is not a great analogy. We'd love to "move on", the issue are the issues!
 
Last edited:
As for the Prime Minister not being important, in real terms that is a total nonsense of course. They set the agenda. They provide leadership. They are the face of the nation and determine the direction of travel.

One of Gutter Boys' gems: "PM isn't an important role"...you could make a coffee table book of the very best.
 
Last edited:
Rorschach said:
Here's me thinking that the economy and Brexit are somehow relatedo_O. YouGov has it as 1 in 5 still think it is the most important issue. That is still a significant number.

The reason they didn't discuss Brexit issues in the debate I would guess is that each is trying to out-ERG the other. To question Brexit is to lose their support and be cast as a Brexit apostate. Madness really that the most significant thing that has happened politically in the UK in a generation will remain the least discussed topic.
Click to expand...

I think it's more people are still looking backwards, discussing the vote and all the other issues that have been discussed to death (though I guess never closed), the electorate are now looking forwards to the debate has to move on to how the country will be defined going forwards - is that deregulation, more trade with Asia, more nationalistic etc.
 
Gutter Boy said:
What more is there to talk about, now it has succeeded completely? Northern Ireland protocol is of interest to a few hundred thousand DUP voters, but not really anyone else.

Now we are free to choose whatever path we want. If Labour propose nationalisation programmes in future elections, they will actually be able to implement them now. And the same with any other proposals that were previously prevented by EU competition laws.

I still don't get this view that we somehow live in a presidential system. Your local MP and the manifesto they are standing against are the only things anyone ever gets to vote for. And thank fudge for that. Imagine the even greater harm President Johnson or President Blair might have caused without some of our parliamentary restraints and checks.
Click to expand...
The NIP is critically important to everyone on the Island of Ireland. Its important to everyone who has a vested interest in peace and the Good Friday agreement - the UK, the EU, the USA. Silly comments like that just dilute any other points you make.
 
P.D. said:
I think it's more people are still looking backwards, discussing the vote and all the other issues that have been discussed to death (though I guess never closed), the electorate are now looking forwards to the debate has to move on to how the country will be defined going forwards - is that deregulation, more trade with Asia, more nationalistic etc.
Click to expand...
I dont think people are looking back at all really, from what I read anyway. The conversation is predominantly about issues that have fallen out of the new arrangement with the EU and how they are being ignored. Turning a blind eye to the growing list of problems just seems nuts to me. There needs to be an honesty about this first and foremost.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DTA
That “speech” from Johnson in the confidence debate…Jesus. Claiming success in every aspect of his premiership and warbling on about “the deep state.” He’s gone full Trump.

He is a serious risk for the next six weeks.

A completely repellent human being.

Has there been a worse Speaker than Hoyle, by the way?
 
Rorschach said:
The NIP is critically important to everyone on the Island of Ireland. Its important to everyone who has a vested interest in peace and the Good Friday agreement - the UK, the EU, the USA. Silly comments like that just dilute any other points you make.
Click to expand...

Sorry - I meant getting rid of it is a fringe/minority desire by DUP supporters, not that the protocol itself is of minor interest. We should just get on and implement it, and call the DUP's bluff by offering the Alliance Party the deputy leader role if they won't take it.
 
Mikey10 said:
That “speech” from Johnson in the confidence debate…Jesus. Claiming success in every aspect of his premiership and warbling on about “the deep state.” He’s gone full Trump.

He is a serious risk for the next six weeks.

A completely repellent human being.

Has there been a worse Speaker than Hoyle, by the way?
Click to expand...

I raise you Bercow.
 
Finding the Brexit pledge requirement hilarious.

They are bringing the culture war to a private party where everyone is already signed up and reminding non members what a bunch of loons they are.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back