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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

Every single Liberal minded person who turns a blind eye or even encourages these illegal crossings because they want to provoke people with opposite political views has blood on their hands this morning.

The right and correct thing has always been to find the boats and turn them back. If people went overboard pick them out the water and take them back to France.

The are quite a few posters on here who I think should have a feeling of guilt this morning. These was always going to happen and the reason we have not done the correct thing and turned them back is because of the liberals that like to sprout nonsense about us being racist.

Government is to scared to do the right thing because of the reaction of the media and from people like the liberals on here.

Certain posters and you know who you are. These deaths are your fault, hope you feel proud of yourselves.
 
You were arguing against the RNLI rescuing these people a few weeks ago. This is what happens when there's no one to help them.

Keep clinging to that phoney high ground though.
 
I get that these migrants want help and what happened yesterday was terribly sad
However what is wrong with them asking for help and staying in anyone of the probably 5-10 countries they have gone through to get to France before trying to get across to the land of the free i.e the UK
 
markysimmo said:
I get that these migrants want help and what happened yesterday was terribly sad
However what is wrong with them asking for help and staying in anyone of the probably 5-10 countries they have gone through to get to France before trying to get across to the land of the free i.e the UK
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Most of the refugees do exactly that. It's about 3% apparently (as quoted on the radio this morning, so not sure of the source) of those crossing into Europe that attempt to make it to the UK. Many already have family members who have arrived here ahead of them, or because they speak English rather than French/German or any other European language they feel there will be more opportunities for them here, or they have other connections (such as the Afghan example quoted above).

If it is true that French police are sitting in their vehicles watching boats being launched, as was reported as seen yesterday morning, then they have a large amount of blame to shoulder but I also get that policing the whole coastline all of the time is nigh on impossible.

One suggestion this morning was setting up a facility in France from where refugees could make UK asylum applications, rather than risking the last-leg across the Channel. I don't know whether that would be workable, and can't see the French public being too keen, but it might be a temporary solution at least.

In the meantime it is right that we help anyone in difficulties either in our waters or in French waters if we are nearest to help, as per maritime rules and procedures. (Edit : do it for humanitarian reasons anyway, but if not for that, do it because of maritime protocol).
 
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We receive a fraction of the applications France and Germany do and fewer per resident than the EU average.

May need fact-checking but I read this morning that low income countries host 9 out of 10 displaced people worldwide?
 
Seedy Ron said:
You were arguing against the RNLI rescuing these people a few weeks ago. This is what happens when there's no one to help them.

Keep clinging to that phoney high ground though.
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If that was aimed at me no I was not. I was arguing that anyone taking to the sea in an unsuitable boat be taken back to the shore they set sail from.

People with your type of attitude to these problem are the problem.

But don't worry about their lives, they mean nothing to you so why should it bother you. As long as it makes the government's life difficult, then it is a good thing and screw it if the little guy gets hurt or killed. Everything is OK if you are alright, Jack.
 
Keep clinging on, I'm sure you think it makes you sound good.

It is up to the governments, of UK and France, to work out a better solution to this issue. I'm sorry that upsets you so much, but it is rather their job. Deploying pushback tactics won't stop traffickers, and given the state of the craft involved would almost certainly lead to far more incidents of this kind, but you knew that anyway.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Every single Liberal minded person who turns a blind eye or even encourages these illegal crossings because they want to provoke people with opposite political views has blood on their hands this morning.

The right and correct thing has always been to find the boats and turn them back. If people went overboard pick them out the water and take them back to France.

The are quite a few posters on here who I think should have a feeling of guilt this morning. These was always going to happen and the reason we have not done the correct thing and turned them back is because of the liberals that like to sprout nonsense about us being racist.

Government is to scared to do the right thing because of the reaction of the media and from people like the liberals on here.

Certain posters and you know who you are. These deaths are your fault, hope you feel proud of yourselves.
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How so?

Also, are there people turning a blind eye? What do you mean?
 
What we need is international cooperation to deal with this new route. You can't blame the people trying it - they are just after a better life. You can't blame France, they are not in control of these people. I think the EU is paying Turkey 6 billion Euros to take the bulk of these migrants. Only a tiny number reach us and risk their lives doing so. It was Lorrys and other means not so long ago. As we tighten up one entry area, another is exploited. That is just human nature.

Cross-border collaboration is the only way to address these things. And there aren't neat answers.
 
We should be putting on ferries, take the business away from the smugglers, help them fill out their immigration forms on the way over, get them in our systems day one.
 
Seedy Ron said:
Keep clinging on, I'm sure you think it makes you sound good.

It is up to the governments, of UK and France, to work out a better solution to this issue. I'm sorry that upsets you so much, but it is rather their job. Deploying pushback tactics won't stop traffickers, and given the state of the craft involved would almost certainly lead to far more incidents of this kind, but you knew that anyway.
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I don't care about sounding good on the Internet to a bunch of people I will never meet.

Deploying pushback worked in Australia and would clearly work here because if the immigrants were always pushed back then they would know and others would know to stop paying them and the bottom would fall out of their 'industry'.

The actions of people in this country the charities and immigration lawyers hell even the church who are getting them to change religion so they can stay are encouraging this cruel trade. And they are all supported by people like you.

Congratulations, 40 people died for something you support and encourage. Calling a cruel heartless human being is the nicest way I can think to word it.
 
SpurMeUp said:
What we need is international cooperation to deal with this new route. You can't blame the people trying it - they are just after a better life. You can't blame France, they are not in control of these people. I think the EU is paying Turkey 6 billion Euros to take the bulk of these migrants. Only a tiny number reach us and risk their lives doing so. It was Lorrys and other means not so long ago. As we tighten up one entry area, another is exploited. That is just human nature.

Cross-border collaboration is the only way to address these things. And there aren't neat answers.
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I was reading post-Brexit without the Dublin Convention there are no legal means to return them to the EU.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
I don't care about sounding good on the Internet to a bunch of people I will never meet.

Deploying pushback worked in Australia and would clearly work here because if the immigrants were always pushed back then they would know and others would know to stop paying them and the bottom would fall out of their 'industry'.

The actions of people in this country the charities and immigration lawyers hell even the church who are getting them to change religion so they can stay are encouraging this cruel trade. And they are all supported by people like you.

Congratulations, 40 people died for something you support and encourage. Calling a cruel heartless human being is the nicest way I can think to word it.
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Australia turn back boats "where it is safe to do so" (how large a pinch of salt might be needed with that statement I do not know).
In the case of the Channel, I am not sure that turning back boats to (once again) attempt to navigate the world's busiest shipping lanes could be considered as safe.

And if it were attempted couldn't those in the boats claim asylum once in English waters anyway?
 
Baleforce said:
We should be putting on ferries, take the business away from the smugglers, help them fill out their immigration forms on the way over, get them in our systems day one.
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Why? I welcome our obligation to take refugees and asylum seekers. But why take economic migrants who just fancy coming here? Prioritising those just arriving, over those in need, just means we get the most forceful. It should be a needs-based system, meaning we should only take people processed through UN aid camps.
 
Gutter Boy said:
It should be a needs-based system, meaning we should only take people processed through UN aid camps.
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unfortunately I am afraid that would just open up that route up for exploitation. I suspect there are no simple solution despite the rhetoric of western governments. Perhaps not creating situations such as war and trying to reduce abject poverty that lead to mass migrations would help.
 
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