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*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur v Everton FC ***

SpurMeUp said:
It was but there were a succession of them preceding the goal with the crowd orchestrating the ref.

Obviously the biggest issue was our failure to put away a third goal. Maddison shooting a bit too straight, Warner lacking some conviction and timing etc
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Werners chance has been mentioned a few times, but IIRC (if its the chance where he ran free from just inside their half) he was a yard offside so would have been ruled out.
 
tommysvr said:
Just anecdotal from me watching games, but it feels like this season there’s been a real increase in late goals across the league. But breaking down the ones we’ve conceded:
  • 1 v Everton costly
  • 2 v Chelsea, taking it from 2-1 to 4-1 with 9 men
  • 1 v Saudi Sportswashing Machine to make it 4-1
  • 2 v Wolves, very costly
  • 1 v Palace to make it 2-1 (was nearly 2-2 though)
  • 1 v Burnley to make it 5-2
So we’ve dropped 5 points from them. On the other side, we’ve scored stoppage time goals:
  • 2 v Sheffield United
  • 1 v Liverpool
  • 1 v Emirates Marketing Project
Earning us 6 points. Not sure there’s a whole lot to be taken out of that myself, other than we should have killed a couple of games off earlier than we did.
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Good analysis.

It felt like the late goals conceded had cost us way more than that, whereas we are actually +1 in late goals.

It is probably out there somewhere. all teams concede late goals. Would be good to see that stat for all teams and see who the ones in minus are. Naturally the worst ones will be those near the bottom, but would be interesting to see how the other Top 6/8 teams have fared in the late goals scenario
 
paxtonwolf said:
Good analysis.

It felt like the late goals conceded had cost us way more than that, whereas we are actually +1 in late goals.

It is probably out there somewhere. all teams concede late goals. Would be good to see that stat for all teams and see who the ones in minus are. Naturally the worst ones will be those near the bottom, but would be interesting to see how the other Top 6/8 teams have fared in the late goals scenario
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The games now are averaging an extra 9 minutes over both halves so 10% more playing time
 
When I saw the officials I didnt think we had a chance of winning, possibly drawing.

I told the Everton fans at work they would probably get their long awaited penalty so lump on 'Penalty to be awarded anytime', but I also told them with Stuart Attwell in control of VAR, everything would go their way.

Yes, I am seeing through Lilywhite specs, but all 3 decisions went in their favour. He does not class the blatant push on Vicario as a foul. He does not see the foul for the penalty and I am still not convinced the guy is onisde at the end, but as the supposed rule is there has to be 100% proof the decision is incorrect, then fair enough the on-field decision has to stand
 
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Bedfordspurs said:
It was flagged offside in the game for sure
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Thought it was, so we cant beat Werner for not making it 3-1. Maddison had the big chance and it was a decent shot, but Pickford matched it with his save.
Richarlison had that half-chance to complete the hat-trick but was unlucky.

Other than that I dont think we can beat ourselves up as though we missed loads of chances to seal the points
 
paxtonwolf said:
Thought it was, so we cant beat Werner for not making it 3-1. Maddison had the big chance and it was a decent shot, but Pickford matched it with his save.
Richarlison had that half-chance to complete the hat-trick but was unlucky.

Other than that I dont think we can beat ourselves up as though we missed loads of chances to seal the points
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Agreed
Although their goal was their only shot in the second half IIRC
And it came from a free kick which we should have never given away (we should have controlled the play before hand)
 
paxtonwolf said:
When I saw the officials I didnt think we had a chance of winning, possibly drawing.

I told the Everton fans they would probably get their long awaited penalty so lump on 'Penalty to be awarded anytime', but I also told them with Stuart Attwell in control of VAR, everything would go their way.

Yes, I am seeing through Lilywhite specs, but all 3 decisions went in their favour. He does not class the blatant push on Vicario as a foul. He does not see the foul for the penalty and the I am still not convinced the guy is onisde at the end, but as the supposed rule is there has to be 100% proof the decision is incorrect, then fair enough the on-field decision has to stand
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What was weird was when they drew the lines Romero was the green line and the one furthest from the goal
That Emma’s their guy was offside.
But he wasn’t. I think they named them wrong
I don’t think it was. Foul on Vicario. He has an advantage in that he can use his hands. He just doesn’t jump on set luxes. He is huge and relies on that when he should be stronger and also move more.
The holding in the air was clear and also var checked. Even my Everton supporting mates said that’s a penalty (but they are victims)
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Agreed
Although their goal was their only shot in the second half IIRC
And it came from a free kick which we should have never given away (we should have controlled the play before hand)
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Some people will disgaree, but a good old-fashioned hoof upfield from Kulusevski at that moment was what was needed. We dont do that enough in those situations, yes we cede possession, but at lot further up the pitch
 
Bedfordspurs said:
What was weird was when they drew the lines Romero was the green line and the one furthest from the goal
That Emma’s their guy was offside.
But he wasn’t. I think they named them wrong
I don’t think it was. Foul on Vicario. He has an advantage in that he can use his hands. He just doesn’t jump on set luxes. He is huge and relies on that when he should be stronger and also move more.
The holding in the air was clear and also var checked. Even my Everton supporting mates said that’s a penalty (but they are victims)
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It just seemed to be dismissed so quickly IIRC I dont think we even got more than one replay of the incident
 
paxtonwolf said:
Some people will disgaree, but a good old-fashioned hoof upfield from Kulusevski at that moment was what was needed. We dont do that enough in those situations, yes we cede possession, but at lot further up the pitch
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Actually it was before it where Richy (who was knackered) lost control
That was when it should have been dealt with
 
paxtonwolf said:
Werners chance has been mentioned a few times, but IIRC (if its the chance where he ran free from just inside their half) he was a yard offside so would have been ruled out.
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Yes the timing was off. But it’s more his conviction and confidence. You can see there is ability there to decide a game like that. But Maddison is still a bit rusty. Werner is only a few weeks into his time here.

Second half we creating openings but our mentality was more protecting our lead than nailing them. Postecoglou won’t be happy with that.

But we played only a couple of days before and had nothing left at the end. I thought Ange should have subbed Richarlison around 85. Ran all game and against Brentford. He couldn’t close down after 85. Any fresh legs would have helped.

The most frustrating thing was how close we were to getting the points! Missing Son we’d almost got 6 points from two niggley fixtures. Baby steps.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Yes the timing was off. But it’s more his conviction and confidence. You can see there is ability there to decide a game like that. But Maddison is still a bit rusty. Werner is only a few weeks into his time here.

Second half we creating openings but our mentality was more protecting our lead than nailing them. Postecoglou won’t be happy with that.

But we played only a couple of days before and had nothing left at the end. I thought Ange should have subbed Richarlison around 85. Ran all game and against Brentford. He couldn’t close down after 85. Any fresh legs would have helped.

The most frustrating thing was how close we were to getting the points! Missing Son we’d almost got 6 points from two niggley fixtures. Baby steps.
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Top 4 this season would be great and more than I believe we could have hoped for
It’s very doable and that’s the target now
 
After what Vdv said about retaining possession ( ideally in the opposition half of the pitch). I've just quickly gone through our main players for my perception on how good they are at keeping the ball. It's not based on stats or science, just my thoughts.

Vicario....suspect distribution
Royal....OK
Romero....Some misplacement
Davies.....sound
Vdv.....sound
Udogie.....can be a little rash
Skipp.....sound
Hojbjerg generally OK but with lapses
Bissouma.....inconsistent but can be very good
Maddison ...OK but the nature of his play is obviously adventurous.
Gil....poor
Loco....could be ok if he played enough
Kulu.....has the strength but suspect
Sarr.....sound
Bentancur...going through a blip but sound
Son....a bit like Maddison but possibly weak on the ball
Werner.....seems OK but early days
Johnson......as above.

Feel free to pull this apart and put me right.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Top 4 this season would be great and more than I believe we could have hoped for
It’s very doable and that’s the target now
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To pretend we’re equipped to content for the title is fanciful. Yet, if we had everyone back and firing we can hang with the best.
 
SpurMeUp said:
To pretend we’re equipped to content for the title is fanciful. Yet, if we had everyone back and firing we can hang with the best.
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We could have
I do believe that
But we would have needed luck with injuries and players not in internationals.
That’s not happened hence why we won’t win the league
I’m fine with that as that was never realistic
Top 4 felt a stretch before the season but now is the target
 
Thought the Werner chance, offside as it was, was a hell of a save from Pickford, players are coached to put it near the keepers feet, as that’s the hardest spot to adjust to.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
There was a var check for the bear hug on Johnson I think. It was clear holding and a foul, yet nothing given
Shock horror
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I'd really like an explanation for that decision. For me it looked a penalty all day long.

I think for every VAR decision involving possible red cards or penalties, the VAR team should issue a written explanation after every game. The explanations should be published online, along with video footage of the incidents, in a searchable database.

The PL needs more and better public scrutiny, accountability and transparency about its VAR decisions. This will force refs to emphasise consistency in their decisions, reduce speculation and conspiracy theories, and possibly add a bit of humility about wrongful decisions (for all teams, not just when Liverpool is involved).

It's not hard. The PL could have this up and running by next season at a minimal cost - if they wanted to.
 
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