OMT - Spurs v Bournemouth

[Bedfordspurs]

we will agree disagree - Poch failed to win things and was no longer motivating The group. Mourinho is now like an old film we have all seen it before and so have the players.
We need new investment. And we must get rid of Jose. We won’t sell all the players and I can’t stand watching this Mourinho bore feast.

But it’s still the same group that got Poch sacked
That’s factually correct
Their showing no changes to their mindset or efforts

 

[thfcsteff]

We need a root and branch clear out. How many of our current players ( especially in their current malaise) get into one of the top four teams ( i.e. Pool, City, Utd or Chelsea) ? Answer, possibly only Harry living off past glories. The stark truth is our players simply aren't good enough. Our recruitment has been pants. We haven't played well for over 18 months. These players need a massive shake up and most should be sold/ swooped for players with talent - and most importantly hunger.

We have lost our identity as a club. We need to revert to buying young ENGLISH players. Our recent success came when we had Walker, Trippier, Rose, Dier, Dele and Kane providing our foundation with a sprinkling of foreign talent. Sadly, we have departed from this successful model and instead bought in a whole load of wasters from abroad. A massive mistake and one we need to rectify going forward.

I would like to see at least 10 of our current squad sold . Vorm, Gazza, Verts, Aurier, Sissoko, Lamela, NDombele, Moura, Dele and Foyth for starters. Bring back KWP he is much better than Aurier and is home grown. Buy British and Bring Back our Spurs.

Errr...if there's another Bruno Fernandes that we don't fancy ignoring, I'd like him. Eriksen's Danish and he was the metronome. Sonny is SK.

Nationality, in all reality, has fudge all to do with it.

Those players you mentioned had one huge advantage; youth. And hunger. And teachability. I'll take young players with hunger from anywhere around the globe...

 

[thfcsteff]

Plenty. We have good players but a lack of balance in the squad and a game plan worthy of a team with top four ambitions.

We've certainly needed freshening up for a couple of years, but the last manager was clear about that too. The question is, is Mourinho the right person to lead that rebuild? Can we afford him signing expensive, peak year players and then discarding them after the first run of poor results?

No. We can't. But we're stuck. It's looking like a late GF into Gross phase.

 

[thfcsteff]

We did didn’t we? I mean he averaged 5 players a season in
Or are we back in that circle of we didn’t back him the year we didnt buy anyone...
and I thought most agreed that we couldn’t get okayed sin that he wanted so he was happy being brave with the team he had... i may be wrong

It depends how you define "refresh" and whether you believe he got the "refreshment" he wanted. I know what I believe.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

It depends how you define "refresh" and whether you believe he got the "refreshment" he wanted. I know what I believe.

I Believe the amount of players we brought in shows a refresh
Whether those players were good enough, some were lots weren’t and that had a big impact

 

[StephenH]

But it’s still the same group that got Poch sacked
That’s factually correct
Their showing no changes to their mindset or efforts

I don't matter what happened and why to Poch, that's history. Mindsets are changed by the manager and his team

We have to work with the majority of these players at least for the next couple of seasons.
Spurs 'have to' get a tune out of this group because they are going nowhere in the short term due to covid19/money.
If Mourinho cant get them playing in a coherent manner then he must go, no?
If he stays next season with no money I dread to think of the outcome.

 

[Baleforce]

I don't matter what happened and why to Poch, that's history. Mindsets are changed by the manager and his team

We have to work with the majority of these players at least for the next couple of seasons.
Spurs 'have to' get a tune out of this group because they are going nowhere in the short term due to covid19/money.
If Mourinho cant get them playing in a coherent manner then he must go, no?
If he stays next season with no money I dread to think of the outcome.

I agree with that, but we have to give him a chance, he has had success in every management job he's ever had.

 

[StephenH]

I agree with that, but we have to give him a chance, he has had success in every management job he's ever had.

I read the above and then remembered how I felt watching us play the last five games, and our form is deteriorating, if that's possible.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I read the above and then remembered how I felt watching us play the last five games, and our form is deteriorating, if that's possible.

the form is 2 wins, 2 draws and one defeat... it’s actually quite a bit better than when he took over

 

[StephenH]

the form is 2 wins, 2 draws and one defeat... it’s actually quite a bit better than when he took over

Sadly our current streaky results just papers of our hapless performances. I will cheer the team on whoever the manager is, as the majority on here will.
I hate watching Spurs ATM they have looked drained of any enjoyment and method.

 

[Baleforce]

Sadly our current streaky results just papers of our hapless performances. I will cheer the team on whoever the manager is, as the majority on here will.
I hate watching Spurs ATM they have looked drained of any enjoyment and method.

yep, I'm fed up with most of them, a few are keeping their end up and a couple of them are new, but there are plenty who I think just aren't putting the effort in, its very disappointing

my problem is that my expectation is a ratchet action, it's not going backwards, I'm going to be tinkled off until we win the European Cup*

*forever

 

[StephenH]

yep, I'm fed up with most of them, a few are keeping their end up and a couple of them are new, but there are plenty who I think just aren't putting the effort in, its very disappointing

Yes, many are in a bad place. But IMHO that's what Jose get paid to change. Poch got the sack because he couldn't do it and the same rules apply to all managers.
Jose will probably survive till season 21/22. I just have to hope.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Yes, many are in a bad place. But IMHO that's what Jose get paid to change. Poch got the sack because he couldn't do it and the same rules apply to all managers.
Jose will probably survive till season 21/22. I just have to hope.

Poch could turn it around in 18 months and he knew them so well (maybe too well)yet your expecting Jose to do it in 6 months with the same players
I guess the logic is that’s his job but it took klopp more than 3 years to change pool

 

[StephenH]

Poch could turn it around in 18 months and he knew them so well (maybe too well)yet your expecting Jose to do it in 6 months with the same players
I guess the logic is that’s his job but it took klopp more than 3 years to change pool

I prefer your take on things! Keep it up - I need to hear it

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I prefer your take on things! Keep it up - I need to hear it

Please don’t think I am saying that he can fix it but I think he should be given every opportunity

 

[Jurgen the German]

What I am still struggling to come to terms with is is what on Earth has happened to the club since the two defeats against wolves and Burnley last season? They in my opinion were absolutely the catalysts for our implosion on the pitch. Both games where we had the chance to exert pressure on the top 2 and we did what we always do in those games on Poch, we froze. Wind the clock back a mere number of weeks before and we pummelled Everton away 6-2 before Xmas and took maximum points over the 2018 holiday period if I’m not mistaken.

There’s something seriously rotten at the club and I’m convinced those two games are a big factor.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I think I'll pass this one for a change. Weird thing is, we seemed to be doing a lot better during the first few weeks of Mourinho's tenure than we are now. I understand he's not everyone's cup of tea, but his Manchester side wasn't that bad, and the players he had back then weren't vastly superior to what we have now. So either he's completely lost his mojo in a year (but I find that difficult to believe) or the problem lies with the players themselves. Sometimes, you need a clearout to start anew. It's just unfortunate that it should happen now, with a transfer market in shambles and a manager who doesn't have a great record at unearthing gems...

It could also be that he's treating the last few games as a preseason of sort but since there won't be much a summer break, that doesn't bode well for the future.

He had already lost that Mojo at Utd though hadn’t he? His final year there was pretty bad

I Believe the amount of players we bought in shows a refresh
Whether those players were good enough, some were lots weren’t and that had a big impact

At first we refreshed.... and Poch kept delivering us CL finishes and good performances. Then we went into a season (after multiple players went late into the World Cup) and didn’t refresh at all. Predictably we crashed and burned in second half of season. We then gave him 3 new signings (probably half as many as we should’ve made after a year of inactivity) and sacked him before he had them fully fit and available. So Poch was having to use a two year stale team (with 3 players in the final year of their contract).

 

[Mr Gogolak]

He had already lost that Mojo at Utd though hadn’t he? His final year there was pretty bad

I'm not going to argue about that. I'd also add, against my own earlier point, that sometimes, a good manager can be made obsolete in a matter of months. With us, George Graham never came close to the success he had when he managed Arsenal.

For what it's worth, I think Mourinho's on a downward spiral and unless something shows otherwise very soon, I don't think he's willing to change his ways. It's funny because he strikes me as a clever man but it's quite obvious that what he was doing before isn't working anymore. He said he took a step back after being sacked by Manchester United but it's hard to see any proof of that.

Now, having said that, this group of players have been working under two different managers this season and they look as apathetic now as they did eight months ago. Sadly, they're starting to remind me of that bunch of losers we had back in the 90s: guys like Ferdinand, Walker, Carr and a few others who obviously thought we were too big to go down and couldn't be bothered to put in the necessary effort to be anything but mid-table fodder (when they weren't sucked into a relagation battle).

Of course, the players we currently have have proved to be a lot better but I think their mentality is becoming suspect. I'm not an avid reader of the English press, but I'm yet to see any of them rebelling against our current situation. They're happy to let Mourinho take the blame and make an ass of himself in press conferences. It's so bad that we're happy (manager included) when two of them fight on the pitch. Depressing...

 

[Pirate55]

Errr...if there's another Bruno Fernandes that we don't fancy ignoring, I'd like him. Eriksen's Danish and he was the metronome. Sonny is SK.

Nationality, in all reality, has fudge all to do with it.

Those players you mentioned had one huge advantage; youth. And hunger. And teachability. I'll take young players with hunger from anywhere around the globe...

I take it you did actually read my post as your reply indicates you didn't. I said I wanted a core of hungry young English players ( like Poch had) supplemented by some key foreign talent. I did not say NO foreign talent. However, I think a lot of our current squad are merely paid mercenaries and their performances show they don't have the desire to run through walls for the club.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

He had already lost that Mojo at Utd though hadn’t he? His final year there was pretty bad

At first we refreshed.... and Poch kept delivering us CL finishes and good performances. Then we went into a season (after multiple players went late into the World Cup) and didn’t refresh at all. Predictably we crashed and burned in second half of season. We then gave him 3 new signings (probably half as many as we should’ve made after a year of inactivity) and sacked him before he had them fully fit and available. So Poch was having to use a two year stale team (with 3 players in the final year of their contract).

That final year of Jose at United he was 6th when they sacked him and he was nearer 4th than we were when we sacked Poch points wise and league table wise