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Next Spurs Manager

billyiddo said:
So in answer to my question the answer is yes? After 5 good seasons, one bad one (or one bad half season in this case) is where you draw your line of support for the manager?
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Do you think it’s legitimate to consider the sample size is actually 40 games, or do you think it is only fair to look at this season in isolation?

Do you agree that should the current malaise not be arrested that we will become relegation candidates in the forthcoming weeks, and have you spotted shoots of recovery?

One final thing that I think is important: would you be minded to agree that poch has done himself no favours with his courting of other jobs? Personally, I feel he has denied himself a degree of latitude he would normally be afforded in this scenario through his actions, for example, in the run up to the cl final.

Do you have any sympathy with that view point?
 
Bedfordspurs said:
You just said a new man comes in and it’s instant drive and energy.... that’s flicking a switch isn’t it?
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You know exactly that’s what happens, not just at this club but around the whole world.

billyiddo said:
So that's it then after 5 seasons? One season outside the top 4 and it's thanks, see you later?

And people claim they aren't entitled
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It’s got nothing to do with being outside the top 4, I said the minimum expectation with this squad is we should be COMPETING for top 4, if you can’t see the difference then GHod help.

Everything comes to a end it’s a sad fact of life, it happens at every club and happens to top managers, but sticking your head in the sand, ignoring what’s in front of you and hoping all the problems disappear is a dangerous way to live.
 
SylDave said:
You know exactly that’s what happens, not just at this club but around the whole world.



It’s got nothing to do with being outside the top 4, I said the minimum expectation with this squad is we should be COMPETING for top 4, if you can’t see the difference then GHod help.

Everything comes to a end it’s a sad fact of life, it happens at every club and happens to top managers, but sticking your head in the sand, ignoring what’s in front of you and hoping all the problems disappear is a dangerous way to live.
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It does not always happen. I would actually say it more often than not over the course of a season makes no difference.

We are competing for a top four, along with man u 2 points in front and arsenal 3points in front. We are not competing well, but we are competing.
 
glasgowspur said:
It does not always happen. I would actually say it more often than not over the course of a season makes no difference.

We are competing for a top four, along with man u 2 points in front and arsenal 3points in front. We are not competing well, but we are competing.
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We are not competing for top 4, the best we can hope for this season without a change is a stress free mid table finish.

Everything about the club right now has the hallmarks of the end, it actually reminds of the end of Gerry Francis we let in 7 at Saudi Sportswashing Machine and he was allowed to carry for basically another year, to lesser effect it’s a like the end of Ramos after the league cup win.
 
Armchair Expert said:
Do you think it’s legitimate to consider the sample size is actually 40 games, or do you think it is only fair to look at this season in isolation?

Do you agree that should the current malaise not be arrested that we will become relegation candidates in the forthcoming weeks, and have you spotted shoots of recovery?

One final thing that I think is important: would you be minded to agree that poch has done himself no favours with his courting of other jobs? Personally, I feel he has denied himself a degree of latitude he would normally be afforded in this scenario through his actions, for example, in the run up to the cl final.

Do you have any sympathy with that view point?
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Last season had plenty of mitigating factors to consider when looking at our 2nd half of the season form, factors most people were in agreement with at the time - these don't dissapear because it makes this seasons form look worse and strengthen your arguments, so imv last seasons 2nd half form is a bit if a red herring.

The form point is obvious, our current form if not improved will have us in a relegation battle. I think the line up from the weekend is potentially a sign we are moving away from the wantaways, let's see where it goes from here.

I don't fully agree that he has courted other jobs and think he gets misinterpreted, wilfully in some instances, but he doesn't help himself in that regard by giving people the opportunity to do so. Ultimately he could have walked out on us and in to any job of his choosing in the last 2-3 seasons and the fact he is still here shows what really should be made of any supposed courting of other jobs.
 
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SylDave said:
You know exactly that’s what happens, not just at this club but around the whole world.



It’s got nothing to do with being outside the top 4, I said the minimum expectation with this squad is we should be COMPETING for top 4, if you can’t see the difference then GHod help.

Everything comes to a end it’s a sad fact of life, it happens at every club and happens to top managers, but sticking your head in the sand, ignoring what’s in front of you and hoping all the problems disappear is a dangerous way to live.
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The thread of discussion was talking about us being 3 points from 5th, making the season salvageable - regardless i think a manager with 5 good seasons under his belt can be afforded one poor season
 
LemonadeMoney said:
Ramos won the League Cup. That was good too. We were lucky to finish 4th last season, should have easily been 3rd.
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Had we not been distracted by the CL run we may well have been, it was certainly an excuse plenty liked to use for Liverpool the season we pipped them to 3rd. There were also other factors like no signings, the bulk of the first team going deep at the WC and the delayed stadium move to contend with.
 
glasgowspur said:
We haven't spent £1bn on the team. You are measuring the quality of the team on the spend on the stadium.
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I'm not measuring the quality of the team, I questioning the narrative that we don't spend money (it's untrue). We have spent almost as much, we just by circumstance had to spend it on facilities.
 
billyiddo said:
Had we not been distracted by the CL run we may well have been, it was certainly an excuse plenty liked to use for Liverpool the season we pipped them to 3rd. There were also other factors like no signings, the bulk of the first team going deep at the WC and the delayed stadium move to contend with.
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That argument held water last season but the fact our downturn has continued and worsened into this season raises questions over whether no signings, the WC, the stadium move were really impacting on our form or if they were just excuses.
 
Raziel said:
For all the people that think "right off this season" no Europe next season .. just keep in mind the age of Kane and Son

If anyone thinks both of them will take a season out of Europe in the prime of their career ..

And if we need to replace one or both of them .. on top of the other changes, fudging mess.
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To be really honest i do not see many fans saying no Europe next season, we may not make the top four who knows but i still believe we will climb the table sooner rather then later. How far down the table does the EL places go now? some fans may turn their backs on it ( foolishly imo)
 
There is no other man I want more than Poch to lead the transition into Tottenham 2.0. However, his constant flirtation with other clubs (even right before the Champions League Final) has unsurprisingly made many of our fans (and the players?) feel like his head is somewhere else and doesn't have as much commitment as we need from him.

I'd love to see Levy give him a new contract or get some sort of strong public commitment from Poch, so we know if we are going to persist w/ him through this rough patch, our loyalty will be reciprocated.

If not, it feels like we might be nearing the end, and the person I THINK Levy will pick will be Mourinho. And if he does, I will be excited about it b/c he's inarguably an incredible coach and a serial winner who knows how to win things and is already settled in London. Crucially, I also think hiring Mourinho would hint that we are looking to spend some actual, big-club money and are focusing on challenging at the top of the table.
 
Nobody expects us to go down because we have good players, but I feel like this is Chelsea in the season they finished outside the top 6.
 
DeanoAustin said:
That argument held water last season but the fact our downturn has continued and worsened into this season raises questions over whether no signings, the WC, the stadium move were really impacting on our form or if they were just excuses.
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Our struggles this season and last season are being conflated partly because it lends itself to a stronger anti Poch narrative. I think the factors for our poor run this season and the end of last are related but with a raft of new problems; namely a squad with several discontented elements hanging around like a bad smell.

That's not to say there shouldn't be alarm at our slide. But I don't feel the ever growing number of games which Poch is being measured against is entirely fair. Especially when it ignores our form until Feb, when we were title contenders and we reached the final of the biggest European cup competition.

The "Poch wants out* narrative I just find bizzare. If he wanted out he would just leave as he did at Southampton. I agree with @billyiddo that Poch is being wilfully misinterpreted.
 
It’s best to keep an open mind.
The truth will come out and when it does that will be the time to chew over the ‘facts’!
We are all ATM just guessing!
 
Robspur12 said:
Our struggles this season and last season are being conflated partly because it lends itself to a stronger anti Poch narrative. I think the factors for our poor run this season and the end of last are related but with a raft of new problems; namely a squad with several discontented elements hanging around like a bad smell.

That's not to say there shouldn't be alarm at our slide. But I don't feel the ever growing number of games which Poch is being measured against is entirely fair. Especially when it ignores our form until Feb, when we were title contenders and we reached the final of the biggest European cup competition.

The "Poch wants out* narrative I just find bizzare. If he wanted out he would just leave as he did at Southampton. I agree with @billyiddo that Poch is being wilfully misinterpreted.
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Some good points in there. A few weeks ago, I was convinced he wanted out. Now, I'm not so sure. However, I don't think he'd just walk away from a compensation package. He didn't just leave Southampton, he moved to Tottenham.

You make a good argument on the run of form. However, performances have been similarly anaemic and results very similar to the end of last season so it's no surprise that people judge the decline as a whole rather than two different spells. It seems you're suggesting that we ignore last season and just judge him on this season's poor run. Personally, I disagree but whatever way you look at it, he's underachieving badly.

Last season we were in the title race until February and we had the best away record in Europe if I'm not mistaken. We've absolutely fallen off a cliff since then but, in my view, we were lucky to be there because performances had been ropey for at least 10 months at that stage (and I think some of the stats back that up).

I also never really took the WC as that much of a reason for bad form. I did think the lack of signings and the extra season at Wembley were a problem though. However, our form this season has made me wonder if I overstated it. Maybe, maybe not.

Either way, as long as he wants to be here, I'm happy for him to get time but the signs aren't good. He's either had two very bad spells or he's having one very long bad spell. If it continues for another couple of months, it'll be very, very difficult to make a case for him to stay. He needs a run of league wins very quickly.
 
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