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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

I was there for all of them.... Brighton felt the worst by a long way. That was proper abject. The worst performance since Liverpool at home under AVB I’d say. Watford was second but a long way behind (although that perhaps counts City away as a plucky, backs to the wall draw as opposed to the footballing lesson that it actually was).

Happy to take your word on it. I think my Saudi Sportswashing Machine experience was further clouded by the interminable heat, the lack of water in the stadium and my train being cancelled afterwards.

Oh - and the s.h.i.t football. :D
 
A little of topic but only other thread I could put is the PL one but that doesn't seem right.
Is it right our next two league games are away to Liverpool and Everton?
So after 11 games we will have been away to City, arsenal, Liverpool, Leicester and Everton?
Fudge me, did we tinkle someone off.

Just think how good the run-in is going to feel.
 
So because Bayern beat us 7-2 the players suddenly stop trying in the next game? I just don't buy it.

I was at the game on Saturday and (other than Toby, where it's nothing new IMO) there was no lack of effort from Spurs. There definitely looks to be a lack of confidence with some players and I think that is translating to playing far too safe

No.

Because Bayern put 7 past us, in a game where the manager fudged the players completely, following game after game of random and poor tactical decisions, the players finally lost faith in the leadership of the team.

I put it in bullet points, FFS, and you are still determined to entirely miss the point.

As I said, I dont doubt your intelligence at all, so at this point I can only assume its some kind of wind up.

How about I tap out and we let it drop?


That’s a fudging first!.... Though I bet you won’t.

Not sure it intended as a witty zinger, or just being a dingdonghead. Maybe Ill never know?
 
Makes sense. Levy is the Founder.
Poch was bought in as the new Sales Director, after the last guy foundered. He had a great few years, but recently has started making bad decisions and is losing clients and upsetting the other staff. It might be time for a new Sales Director, or we could ride it out... it is up to the Sales Director to turn things around.

It’s not really a perfect metaphor in this regard. A football club is slightly different in that Levy could never wish to have Poch’s expertise and vice versa. Poch, by being exceptional, put us way ahead of schedule.

It’s more like having a Founder who is technical, and that Founder hiring a COO who is more commercial. The obvious example is Zuckerberg and Sandberg. Both are exceptional in their own right, but they compliment each other perfectly and Facebook doesn’t scale to what it is without either one of them. Things are now hitting Facebook though - PR disasters, lack of trust, fake news, election interference, and it’s going to effect the business. Are they rushing to sack Sandberg? They aren’t.
 
It felt like a move to future Spurs tonight (although note - when Poch has an opportunity to say exactly that in the post match after being teed up, he didn’t say it. He continues to defend the group as a group. He’s still being the leader, protecting all the egos until the point that through his actions he removes them.)

But just really nice to see. Every player on the pitch has a reason to be there. Aurier wanted to leave, but it’s not like he’s ever had real success here, and it’s not like he’d go to anywhere near a better club than us, so there’s still a lot in it for him to try to succeed here. Jan has never felt like Toby, it’s always felt more likely he could get an extention. Great seeing Davies and Sanchez back instead of Rose and Toby. And the rest of the team, great to see them performing well. All motivated, all want to be here. Eriksen on the bench and Lamela showing we don’t need him on to play some nice football.

Yes it was only Red Star, but we’ve quite easily turned in terrible performances against worse teams, so this is a positive. It doesn’t feel like a group that has given up, but it does feel like a group that is more fully committed to being here long term. Even the players he wanted to make sure had minutes are ones I expect he counts on their loyalty for the long term. It felt like something of a shift tonight; and it will be interesting to see if and how he includes Toby, Rose and Eriksen going forward.
 
It felt like a move to future Spurs tonight (although note - when Poch has an opportunity to say exactly that in the post match after being teed up, he didn’t say it. He continues to defend the group as a group. He’s still being the leader, protecting all the egos until the point that through his actions he removes them.)

But just really nice to see. Every player on the pitch has a reason to be there. Aurier wanted to leave, but it’s not like he’s ever had real success here, and it’s not like he’d go to anywhere near a better club than us, so there’s still a lot in it for him to try to succeed here. Jan has never felt like Toby, it’s always felt more likely he could get an extention. Great seeing Davies and Sanchez back instead of Rose and Toby. And the rest of the team, great to see them performing well. All motivated, all want to be here. Eriksen on the bench and Lamela showing we don’t need him on to play some nice football.

Yes it was only Red Star, but we’ve quite easily turned in terrible performances against worse teams, so this is a positive. It doesn’t feel like a group that has given up, but it does feel like a group that is more fully committed to being here long term. Even the players he wanted to make sure had minutes are ones I expect he counts on their loyalty for the long term. It felt like something of a shift tonight; and it will be interesting to see if and how he includes Toby, Rose and Eriksen going forward.
Green shoots of Poch 2.0.

Having LaCelso (is it me or can you just tell he's gonna be a player?) and Sess looking like options, and Ndom Dele Dier and Foyth building their fitness, opens the door to move things along. Fingers crossed we can stay relatively injury free for a bit.

Not on the bench last night were....KWP Sess Skipp Wanyama. So if Rose Toby and Eriksen sit out completely....its no problem.

Against Watford there were not many positives. Probably Dele looking a bit more his usual self and starting the second half with purposes and intent (mainly led by Son).

Last night we started with purpose and intent from the get go. Yes they may have been poor (who knows?) but the attitude from us is what's important. The forward play was creative, inventive and varied. I'm sure theyre capable of that, and I don't think it's a tactical thing...it's just a mindset.

The defence still worries me....it doesn't take much to rattle us. I think this will be the thing that gives us fluctuations going forward. Maybe getting some solid protection in front of them will help but without doubt there is lots of work to do.

Question? Do both Foyth and Sanchez prefer the right side of CB?
 
Footballers will say they want to leave and yet expect to play if they are still contracted to one club. It is ridiculous, and it is not how we as fans would reasonably expect to act if we were in the same situation. But they are footballers, and I think Poch has to deal with that. It isn’t optimal, but not doing it this way could make things even worse more quickly.

I agreed with the sentiment of your post but 90% of employees whinge about their jobs, at least that’s been my experience. Were these employees to be headhunted none would remain, yet, it’s not as common an occurrence that non football employees are head hunted. Truth is most employees don’t have the passion and desire required to be successful as they are stuck in the now mindset rather than that of the future. If players wanting out could appreciate that their chance to leave will hinge, at least partially, on them working hard and being successful where they are then there would be less issues and that applies then equally to football and non football.
 

Indeed.
As I have said, Poch is also learning. Learning who he can trust and for how long. In his first season he gave some the rope needed to fail. This season, I think he has been shocked by how some of his seniors have let him down. I have always believed he would need to learn to drop them, and that it would take time because of who he is, but he would get there.

Tricky dance until January, but the time has come...

...the top managers learn. I think he is a top top manager. I think he is learning.
 
Indeed.
As I have said, Poch is also learning. Learning who he can trust and for how long. In his first season he gave some the rope needed to fail. This season, I think he has been shocked by how some of his seniors have let him down. I have always believed he would need to learn to drop them, and that it would take time because of who he is, but he would get there.

Tricky dance until January, but the time has come...

...the top managers learn. I think he is a top top manager. I think he is learning.

No time for learning! fudge him off.
 
Indeed.
As I have said, Poch is also learning. Learning who he can trust and for how long. In his first season he gave some the rope needed to fail. This season, I think he has been shocked by how some of his seniors have let him down. I have always believed he would need to learn to drop them, and that it would take time because of who he is, but he would get there.

Tricky dance until January, but the time has come...

...the top managers learn. I think he is a top top manager. I think he is learning.

... Or....

He is learning that words and perceptions are key as a leader and you can't preach about togetherness and loyalty to your key players, whilst seemingly not practicing in public what you preach (e.g. Quotes on leaving the club, quality of squad etc)...

A harsh lesson indeed, but hopefully just that..
 
... Or....

He is learning that words and perceptions are key as a leader and you can't preach about togetherness and loyalty to your key players, whilst seemingly not practicing in public what you preach (e.g. Quotes on leaving the club, quality of squad etc)...

A harsh lesson indeed, but hopefully just that..


Sigh.


<<
When asked whether the players are behind Pochettino, Alli responded: ‘Yeah, 1,000 per cent. A lot of us would not be where we are now if it was not for him. All we can do is thank him. ‘We have always trusted him 100 per cent and we are going to keep doing that. We are a team. When things are not going our way it is easy for people to try and get at the manager but we need to look at ourselves as players. ‘We are doing that and we are going to keep working hard.’


Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2019/10/23/dele...pochettino-red-star-win-10969172/?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/>>
 
Sigh.


<<
When asked whether the players are behind Pochettino, Alli responded: ‘Yeah, 1,000 per cent. A lot of us would not be where we are now if it was not for him. All we can do is thank him. ‘We have always trusted him 100 per cent and we are going to keep doing that. We are a team. When things are not going our way it is easy for people to try and get at the manager but we need to look at ourselves as players. ‘We are doing that and we are going to keep working hard.’


Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2019/10/23/dele...pochettino-red-star-win-10969172/?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/>>

We've had good PR pop up every now and then, Steff; we've heard similar positive gushes before capitulating badly in games so far this season so all this talk is irrelevant until we see things to that effect consistently on the pitch.

However, to absolve the manager of some of the blame for our current malaise is myopic at best: no-one can talk about any players "letting him down" without also criticising Poch's his own conduct in press conferences - including actually saying he would leave it the team won the CL AND REITERATING IT AFTERWARDS in case anyone thought he was joking or misquoted.
Example, Eriksen cannot be accused of "lack of loyalty" or "lack of commitment" by Poch (or anyone who fails to criticise Poch for his own words) after that.

We have to be fair in analysing where we are and how we got here
 
A big step in seeing his learning curve will be if he plays the same side Sunday.

Play a different side on Sunday and lose (especially badly) will not help his leadership position, play the same and lose, it's completely understandable, this 11 earned that right.
 
A big step in seeing his learning curve will be if he plays the same side Sunday.

Play a different side on Sunday and lose (especially badly) will not help his leadership position, play the same and lose, it's completely understandable, this 11 earned that right.

There is a still a part of me fearing that Rose and Alderweireld at the least were rested for Sunday, but it’s not just this weekend too the next few weeks even into January are key for me, if he shows he is picking the right teams in a shape that suit the lads and it starts to look like we are building something he will start to slowly regain my trust, Tuesday helped and as brick as they were we can only beat what’s in front of us.

Let’s just hope it’s not back to formation lottery or eight defenders against teams parking the bus from the offset.
 
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