How many players in our squad are consistent top 4 quality?

[Maltese Falcon]

I guess yesterday was a chastening reply to the question of the post. In a way it was maybe for the better (I know, clutching at straws here...) as it provides a reality check to all of us.

 

[billyiddo]

I guess yesterday was a chastening reply to the question of the post. In a way it was maybe for the better (I know, clutching at straws here...) as it provides a reality check to all of us.

Is a defeat to United any more of a indicator to our quality than the wins and performances against Chelsea/Arsenal?

 

[Maltese Falcon]

Is a defeat to United any more of a indicator to our quality than the wins and performances against Chelsea/Arsenal?

I think so. We are capable of pulling off a great rabbit out of the hat - especially when we are under no pressure.

However we the chips are down and we need to get a result - as last Sunday was for our CL aspirations - we consistently fall at the hurdle. This is what a top 4 team does. That's why I see Liverpool in that category but not us - yet.

As I said, for me Sunday was a reality check and showed me that for all our optimism we still have a chasm to get to consistent top 4 quality; this will need both our youngsters to gain experience (I think we expect too much from 20 and 21 year olds) and also a sprinkling of genuine quality and experience

 

[billyiddo]

Have to say it looks like confirmation bias to me - we're on a 2 ppg run of form stretching back to when the current team took shape in November, the last 3 months has seen us comfortably beat the Champions elect and Arsenal, the form team in the league at the time, and gone away to the other form team and rival for top 4 Liverpool and give them a good game - but all that means nothing because we had a bad performance away to United?

The gap isn't as big as you imply

 

[braineclipse]

Have to say it looks like confirmation bias to me - we're on a 2 ppg run of form stretching back to when the current team took shape in November, the last 3 months has seen us comfortably beat the Champions elect and Arsenal, the form team in the league at the time, and gone away to the other form team and rival for top 4 Liverpool and give them a good game - but all that means nothing because we had a bad performance away to United?

The gap isn't as big as you imply

Spot on!

People seemingly always need us to "win one more" to count us as challengers. It's not enough to beat Chelsea, we have to beat the next team. And then United. Seemingly ignoring that all the teams around us are largely speaking as inconsistent as ourselves. If that wasn't the case we'd be trailing 4th by a lot more than 6 points.

This was either the hardest or the second hardest game of our last 10 games in the league. Lose it and all of a sudden we're "not a top 4 team". Doesn't add up to me.

 

[superpav]

anyone would think we have a great defence with some of these mark ups lol
we let in the most goals in the top half of the league
more then swansea but people still think walker lloris verts or world class
lloris is a very good keeper but not world class
walker is so overrated and it says a lot when we look more solid with naughton and chirches at right back

 

[Maltese Falcon]

Based on this season's performances, I guess the one consistent player who is top 4 must be Lloris.

Kane? I think we need to wait till next season. Eriksen - no way! no top 4 player goes as anonymous as he has been since the turn of the year.

The rest? on this year's showing incredibly enough it could just be Danny Rose - who would have thought it!!

Shows the massive task we have to get a top 4 spot again

 

[King of Norway]

I think Danny Rose this season must come close to being good enough to play left back for a top 4 team. I certaibly think he has been better than a couple of those who do.

Lloris is good enough. Kane has been good enough this season. Eriksen would have looked better in a better team, I think. Wouldn't have looked out of place in a top four team.

 

[Maltese Falcon]

Eriksen would have looked better in a better team, I think. Wouldn't have looked out of place in a top four team.

That was what I used to think; now I'm not so sure.

Has all the tools but seems to laid back, unwilling to take a game by the scruff of the neck. Still young and seems a bit naive though. Our midfield DESPERATELY needs an experienced top class midfielder - must be our priority for next season. Schneiderlin would be fantastic, Moutinho as well, even someone like Sissoko at Saudi Sportswashing Machine or Delph at Villa... but please get someone!

 

[Neymar]

Eriksen would have looked better in a better team, I think. Wouldn't have looked out of place in a top four team.

i think a lot of our players wouldnt look out of place in a top 4 team. we have far more than a handful of players that would do well in top 4 teams imo.

if the thread question was reversed, and it asked how would the likes of arteta, flamini, monreal, gibbs, chambers, walcott, welbeck, valencia, young, blind, smalling, jones, fellaini, fernando, fernandinho, clichy, mangala, drogba, remy, mikel, ramires, cahill etc look in our squad, i think the answer would be 'no different to any of our other players'. players like chadli are more than capable of playing a part at one of these clubs imo. these clubs maybe have a few more really exceptional players than us, and debateably a bit better team chemistry because they are able to better hold onto key players for their system/style of play due to better financial positions. when a player becomes vital for us to play our style of football, we inevitably lose them; bale, modric, keane etc.

in terms of indiviual player quality, i really dont think the gap is that big

 

[King of Norway]

That was what I used to think; now I'm not so sure.

Has all the tools but seems to laid back, unwilling to take a game by the scruff of the neck. Still young and seems a bit naive though. Our midfield DESPERATELY needs an experienced top class midfielder - must be our priority for next season. Schneiderlin would be fantastic, Moutinho as well, even someone like Sissoko at Saudi Sportswashing Machine or Delph at Villa... but please get someone!

I agree he doesn't dominate games, at least not often, but in a better team he wouldn't have to be the player to carry the team. In a team with a lot of attacking talent I think he would have the ability to link up well with these players. He is talented enough to do that. There is a lot of responsibilty on his shoulders when playing for us, as he is basically our only player with creativity.

 

[braineclipse]

Bentaleb would walk into that City midfield and be a solid upgrade on both Ferndando and Fernandinho.

 

[King of Norway]

i think a lot of our players wouldnt look out of place in a top 4 team. we have far more than a handful of players that would do well in top 4 teams imo.

if the thread question was reversed, and it asked how would the likes of arteta, flamini, monreal, gibbs, chambers, walcott, welbeck, valencia, young, blind, smalling, jones, fellaini, fernando, fernandinho, clichy, mangala, drogba, remy, mikel, ramires, cahill etc look in our squad, i think the answer would be 'no different to any of our other players'. players like chadli are more than capable of playing a part at one of these clubs imo. these clubs maybe have a few more really exceptional players than us, and debateably a bit better team chemistry because they are able to better hold onto key players for their system/style of play due to better financial positions. when a player becomes vital for us to play our style of football, we inevitably lose them; bale, modric, keane etc.

in terms of indiviual player quality, i really dont think the gap is that big

You are right. I think a lot of players in our squad are good enough to be squad players or one of the weaker links in the starting XI in a top 4 team. However, I thought we were looking for players who are good enough to be regulars and not look like a player who is being carried by the rest of the team.

I do think there is quite a big gulf in class in the quality of individual players when you compare our squad with the current top 4 teams.

 

[Neymar]

You are right. I think a lot of players in our squad are good enough to be squad players or one of the weaker links in the starting XI in a top 4 team. However, I thought we were looking for players who are good enough to be regulars and not look like a player who is being carried by the rest of the team.

I do think there is quite a big gulf in class in the quality of individual players when you compare our squad with the current top 4 teams.

whilst i do accept that you may be entirely right in thinking that there is a big gulf in class between our players and the top 4 sides, i dont neccessarily agree. i just think some of our players look a bit worse than they otherwise would do because of our high turnover rate. our players have little chemistry between them, and so cant show their full potential imo. and also because our squad filled with players of similar ability, no one set of players gets an extended run in the side. i think this could also be a hindrance for the team when trying to create an understanding with one another on the pitch.

perhaps getting a few better(more established) players and some weaker players would produce better results for us. however, that would probably be riskier financially (and maybe even on the pitch too), so i can undestand why we wouldnt want to do this.

 

[Maltese Falcon]

All I can say is: look at United's defeat to WBA and ours to Villa. Both 0-1 but light years apart in terms of quality of play by the losing team.

 

[Bullet]

. i just think some of our players look a bit worse than they otherwise would do because of our high turnover rate. our players have little chemistry between them, and so cant show their full potential imo. and also because our squad filled with players of similar ability, no one set of players gets an extended run in the side. i think this could also be a hindrance for the team when trying to create an understanding with one another on the pitch.

You're right Neymar, as soon as l'Arse look settled Walcott comes in, then he gets injured and Wheelchair comes in, then the Ox, then Ramsey, no wonder they can't settle. And what about Welbeck? Surely he deserves an extended run more than anyone?

 

[Cochise]

We have a solid squad, but very few individuals that come into the bracket of top 4. I'll echo someone else in that only Lloris is there with perhaps Rose now being good enough to be considered alongside him (and I wasn't one of his fans at the start of the season). Kane, Bentaleb and Eriksen still need to improve further to make it into that bracket whilst the rest are top half players. In this, I think we truly do need someone alongside Vertonghen or Dier who is of that quality.

 

[mudshark]

We were "top 4 quality" when we had King, Bale, Modrić and van der Vaart in the side. When we've got that calibre of player back in, we'll be "top 4 quality" again. The only player in the squad I'd rank at that level at the moment is Lloris, really, and goalkeepers on their own don't win you games.

 

[Mulletperm]

Lloris - yes
Vorm - no

Walker - no
Yedlin - no
Dier - no
Fazio - no
Vertonghen - no
Kaboul - no
Chiriches - no
Davies - no
Rose - possibly

Bentaleb - not yet
Mason - no
Capoue - no
Paulinho - no
Lamela - no
Townsend - no
Dembele - no
Eriksen - no (sorry, I really don't think he is, not yet anyway)
Stambouli - no

Kane - possibly
Soldado - no
Adebayor - no

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

Lloris.
Kane
Eriksen (maybe.)

That is all.