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FA Cup Semi Final OMT ***Tottenham Hotspur FC v Manchester United***

Haven't posted since before the Brighton. Have read some of the comments since the United game. Thought we had the game under control for 20 minutes then we make one mistake and it all goes to brick. Was so disappointed with the performance in the 2nd half. Was so uninspiring, we barely created anything. 8 semi final defeats in a row. I'm sure some will argue they are simply 8 completely unconnected matches, players and managers have come and gone since 1991 but there must be a reason why Mourinho almost always wins these type of big games and we usually seem to find them as one step too far. I honestly can't figure out if its the manager, the players or if it is merely in the club's DNA.

Lloris hasn't had a good season by his standards and I'm fully aware that Vorm typically starts the FA Cup games, but its the feckin semi final against Man United and Mourinho! It doesn't send out a great message when you pick the back up keeper for such a huge game.

Resources aside, we have a team that should have hurt Man United a lot more than we did on Saturday, and I don't mean physically.

I'd like to see us sign two new first choice full backs. Davies and Trippier can do an admirable job filling in for a few games but I honestly don't think either are good enough for a team that has ambitions to win the title. We also need to resign Toby and get another creativie midfielder, Eriksen can't do it all by himself. If Toby does leave then we need a ready-made, experienced replacement not an 19 year old with potential.

I'd happily give Poch another 2-3 years even if that means no trophies but he has to take a lot of the blame for this defeat IMO. Picked the wrong players and we were poor in the 2nd half. He has a big job to lift the players so we can seal a top 4 finish. Would be a disaster if we fudged that up. I don't think we will but it's not out of the question.
 
I’m just listening to the Grauniad Football Weekly podcast. After their Whinger talk (22-ish minutes or so) they get on to our game. Barney Ronay talks a a lot of sense about perspective on this result, highlighting that three of the defense that did so well for us last year (Rose until Jan) were not playing and that we have no back-up striker. He also pointed to the relative difference in resources between us and them. I know we spanked them in the league at Wembley (a result that might prove more important to out long term development as a force)

Barry Glendenning, who usually loves to hate on us tried the ‘bottlers’ in FA Cup semis and gets patronizingly slapped down by Ronay.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
Desire. urgency. Creativity.
We just lacked in everything.

I am so gutted it hurts.
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Wait a second, we showed plenty of that in the first 20-25 minutes. It's not like we came out meh. And even after their first goal we were still the better team. Understandably in the second half we came out a bit more cautious and after their second goal we struggled to create. It's not like we were pulling out of tackles, or not chasing down. But all the desire in the world isn't going to make you thread a pass, or control a ball better. Even more so against the master of anti-football.

And let's be honest, it's not like they were creating chance after chance and we were passive observers. They got a lucky second goal and then shut up shop. The game could have gone either way. Saturday it was just their day and that's all there is to it. In my view, anyway.
 
90291Spur said:
I’m just listening to the Grauniad Football Weekly podcast. After their Whinger talk (22-ish minutes or so) they get on to our game. Barney Ronay talks a a lot of sense about perspective on this result, highlighting that three of the defense that did so well for us last year (Rose until Jan) were not playing and that we have no back-up striker. He also pointed to the relative difference in resources between us and them. I know we spanked them in the league at Wembley (a result that might prove more important to out long term development as a force)
Barry Glendenning, who usually loves to hate on us tried the ‘bottlers’ in FA Cup semis and gets patronizingly slapped down by Ronay.
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Our defence was fine, as we proved as you say when we beat them a few weeks ago in the league....our bench was strong enough.

The relative difference in resources only matters if your opponent has used those resources well.....how many of the Utd team and bench would get into our first team?
 
DubaiSpur said:
I don't think we can actually win things. It just isn't something I think we can do under Poch now - after we've blown the easiest chance we'll get in a very long time.

Don't get me wrong, the hope is always going to be there. But the intrinsic belief that the team and Poch can cross that last hurdle, the one they've consistently crumbled in front of for four years straight? I don't think we're capable of that. Just a blunt assessment after the team crumbled yet again.

We have definitely, indisputably improved under Poch. We used to be the team that lost both the big games in the league and the big games in pursuit of trophies. Now we're just the team that always loses the big games in pusuit of trophies - the league hoodoos have all fallen, and that's down to him.

But this is one hurdle I just don't think we can overcome. One improvement I don't think Poch can make, and one I don't think the team has the mentality or stomach to handle, even if the desire is there.

I'm slowly resigning myself to the fact that we're perpetually going to be the f*cking 'play-pretty-but-win-nothing' crowd, even with Poch - and this, in a time when even f*cking Wenger wins three FA cups in four years and (possibly) might go out winning the Europa League as well.

So I agree with @Libero - I'm not going to expect anything different going forward. I thought we'd learn from the Juventus loss - pick up that ability to be winners, to be canny, to be ruthless. We didn't.
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The easiest? Yeah, Yanited are not exactly a powerhouse, but they're still a Mourinho-led team with world class players. Some perspective.
 
StephenH said:
Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool will still have a big financial advantage over us for about 4 years as it will take time for the money to arrive.
Even when are on par or at least closer the Cups will always be of a much lower priority as they have a low financial return, yes I agree sad but a fact of life.
Arsenal proved that cup wins count for naught in the champions league age. Great days out for the fans, although Chelsea could not give away thiers tickets yesterday. Its been devalued by everybody,the press, the teams and the governing bodies. Women's football and Darts are becoming a bigger draw.;)
My FA cup memories go back to the mid 60s and started at 8 o'clock in the morning with Uncle Mac on the radio....so im old school.
Thoughs days mean nothing to likes of Pochettino....or even Levy.
Money does not solve all footballing ills ask to guys down the road!
We also picked the wrong side on Saturday, it should have been the one that played Chelsea.....
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I keep on asking this question as I am yet to see a sensible answer. Why will it take 4 years for the money to arrive?
 
Finney Is Back said:
I keep on asking this question as I am yet to see a sensible answer. Why will it take 4 years for the money to arrive?
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It takes time with the big capitol expenditure projects to settle, with money washing out and then coming back more slowly with ticket sales and hospitality etc.

4 years is an arbitrary time frame (guess) but it’s not usually like turning a tap on, more like the pressure from said increases that take a time.
 
Finney Is Back said:
I keep on asking this question as I am yet to see a sensible answer. Why will it take 4 years for the money to arrive?
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£800m infrastructure project for a company that turnsover £200m a year is a delicate balancing act especially against the back drop (pressure) of single members of staff costing £40-50m to acquire.

Arsenal had to rely on Wengers magic to see them thru some years before they were on top of their finance. Granted income maybe more now but players cost much more now and I'm sure Levy will have done the sums (and it's probably not the Leeds route).

I think we're best to look after who we have (wages wise) and feed in more up and comers as Poch develops them,knowing we have a higher wage ceiling to keep them here.

You'd rather give more wages to someone you've seen for a couple of seasons who can do the business than risk too many 30 40 50 m punts.?
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
£800m infrastructure project for a company that turnsover £200m a year is a delicate balancing act especially against the back drop (pressure) of single members of staff costing £40-50m to acquire.

Arsenal had to rely on Wengers magic to see them thru some years before they were on top of their finance. Granted income maybe more now but players cost much more now and I'm sure Levy will have done the sums (and it's probably not the Leeds route).

I think we're best to look after who we have (wages wise) and feed in more up and comers as Poch develops them,knowing we have a higher wage ceiling to keep them here.

You'd rather give more wages to someone you've seen for a couple of seasons who can do the business than risk too many 30 40 50 m punts.?
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I'm pretty sure our debt was only going to be £250m, or something like that. Everything early on (land acquisition/groundworks) was paid for up front by the savings made during the last decade of zero net transfer spend. Then there's the income from the sale of Sainsburys and the flats/hotels at the south end of the site, plus the NHL cash etc.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I'm pretty sure our debt was only going to be £250m, or something like that. Everything early on (land acquisition/groundworks) was paid for up front by the savings made during the last decade of zero net transfer spend. Then there's the income from the sale of Sainsburys and the flats/hotels at the south end of the site, plus the NHL cash etc.
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So basically adding together what we have invested so far to what we will receive from real estate sales equals £550m.?

As you say our trading (£) in players balances at zero. What is our profit on turnover for the last 10years allowing for the easily accountable things like wages, running costs and not to mention 20-30m on a training ground.? I suppose 25m a year for 10years was doable?

I suppose if the real estate return adds up to 300m, you're right. 250m is manageable and if we can lock it in at the current low rates with the ability to repay capital as and when allows (Like when we sell Harry) then it not too much a millstone.

That said, (I am rambling a bit:)) but I'm sure the 250m debt figure was batted about when the project looked like costing 450-500m?
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
I still think we can win things with him but we need to improve the team to help with that.

I still think we were very unfortunate in the semi last year and against Juve earlier in the season.

My doubts have only very recently arisen. Since the Emirates Marketing Project game actually where the tactics used were deeply alarming, it was so very obvious what we had to do that day yet we proceeded to do the opposite - I found that incredibly alarming and then Brighton was also very poor and then yesterday.

To start so well and then freeze when they get a goal is just baffling.

So for me it's only this little run that has started to concern me and I'm only saying he should go if we see similar occurring over the next 2 seasons.

I'm confident with the right investment we will win things with Poch and he'll be here for a long long time.

But I hope he is looking at himself for those abomination of tactics against Emirates Marketing Project and why the players froze yesterday at 1-1.
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You have used the term "we froze" several times in your posts. But ask yourself, is it that we really froze, or is it that the opposition executed a solid gameplan against us, coupled with the fact that a couple of our key players were subpar? We have also made other teams "freeze" and everyone said at the time how well we played our game. Maybe this game was the same, but in reverse. The fact it was a semifinal shouldn't elevate the narrative all of a sudden.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Every cup game we have lost we were winning... and playing better than the other team
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So the issue would be tactics, no? Change the tactics to see out a game. But I think Poch believes this team can whip anyone when playing at the top of it's game, which may be the reason he doesn't adjust. The truth is, however, that we will not maintain this level for an entire game, so tactics do need to change at some point. Just a thought...
 
Kandi1977 said:
I've noticed that Trippier only crosses if he's in acres of space and gets a pin point accurate pass that he can hit first time. If he has to take a touch to control it, he always passes backwards.
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They're playing the percentages, dude. Don't you think they have analyzed hundreds of hours of video and probably determined that the crosses you are referring to have a much lower probability in resulting in something decent, as opposed to playing the ball back out and trying another avenue? You think they're that stupid?
 
alekaras said:
They're playing the percentages, dude. Don't you think they have analyzed hundreds of hours of video and probably determined that the crosses you are referring to have a much lower probability in resulting in something decent, as opposed to playing the ball back out and trying another avenue? You think they're that stupid?
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Ive noticed constantly when Trippier has the ball in a crossing position theres barely anyone ever in the box anyway.....
 
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