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European Super League - Dead on arrival

Lilbaz said:
Wouldn't have happened. The big 6 wouldn't want to leave the prem because it's what gives them an advantage on their competitors. The other 14 clubs wouldn't want them to leave cause the tv rights, sponsorship deals etc... would go through the floor.

It's all moot now anyway.
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They existing 14 clubs couldn't have expelled the big 6 anyway... The magic number of PL members required to vote to expell another member was 15. Hence THFC being invited to the ESL along with the 5 actual big clubs in England to ensure there would only be 14 PL members voting for expulsion.
 
Finney Is Back said:
They existing 14 clubs couldn't have expelled the big 6 anyway... The magic number of PL members required to vote to expell another member was 15. Hence THFC being invited to the ESL along with the 5 actual big clubs in England to ensure there would only be 14 PL members voting for expulsion.
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Did not know that. Why did they make it different to any other vote?
 
Delete the conference and expand the CL significantly so top 6 finishing teams in the top leagues qualify.

Then cup winners and 7th and maybe 8th too go into europa league which due to so much more quality now going to CL, allows uefa to achieve their goal of the conference which was more obscure sides playing european football.
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
Delete the conference and expand the CL significantly so top 6 finishing teams in the top leagues qualify.

Then cup winners and 7th and maybe 8th too go into europa league which due to so much more quality now going to CL, allows uefa to achieve their goal of the conference which was more obscure sides playing european football.
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Conference league is fine - shouldn’t have any big clubs in it though.
Shouldn’t be for sides that have been in CL / EL
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
Delete the conference and expand the CL significantly so top 6 finishing teams in the top leagues qualify.

Then cup winners and 7th and maybe 8th too go into europa league which due to so much more quality now going to CL, allows uefa to achieve their goal of the conference which was more obscure sides playing european football.
Click to expand...

I think top 2 in the 10 biggest leagues in europe go into the champions league and 3rd and 4th go into the Europa league, will make it mean more again. All cup winners go into the conference.
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
Delete the conference and expand the CL significantly so top 6 finishing teams in the top leagues qualify.

Then cup winners and 7th and maybe 8th too go into europa league which due to so much more quality now going to CL, allows uefa to achieve their goal of the conference which was more obscure sides playing european football.
Click to expand...

Nah. At the moment there are different competitions in the prem. The winners ofcourse. Then top 4. Then el. Then conference. Then relegation. Nearly everyone has something to play for. If top 6 get cl (which they might with the new format) then there isn't much difference between 2nd and 6th. Nothing for 7th to 17th.
 
Yiddo said:
I think top 2 in the 10 biggest leagues in europe go into the champions league and 3rd and 4th go into the Europa league, will make it mean more again. All cup winners go into the conference.
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Can’t do that in the modern game as everyone in England would be locked out of the CL apart from the money dopers.
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
Can’t do that in the modern game as everyone in England would be locked out of the CL apart from the money dopers.
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I'd hate it for another reason. At the moment there are different races in the prem. Race for the title, race for top 4, race for europa, battle against relegation. This means that most teams have something to play for, the whole season. Keeps it interesting.

If we did as yiddo suggests from new years, half the teams in the league would have nothing to play for.
 
Yiddo said:
I think top 2 in the 10 biggest leagues in europe go into the champions league and 3rd and 4th go into the Europa league, will make it mean more again. All cup winners go into the conference.
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Very noble of you.

But will quickly become tiresome as, mostly, the same teams keep showing up to play one another in an ever-drearier loop - Bayern & Dortmund (or one other), Porto and Benfica, PSG and one other, Real and Barca, Ajax and Alkmaar, Gent and Genk, Juve and a Milan club, Spurs and City... . You get my drift.
 
i don't see how the courts can stop a private tournament from happening
isn't the world big enough for ESL and FIFA? sure FIFA lose a big chunk of money but they were supposed to be non-profit and non-corrupt anyway. there are other ways to make money for instance taxing player sales between fifa clubs (sorry, player agents).
would be interesting to see the ESL run like the F1 - unlimited finances - maybe we get to see some crazy football innovations like that player-cam and 7 referees for every game.
 
metalgear said:
i don't see how the courts can stop a private tournament from happening
isn't the world big enough for ESL and FIFA? sure FIFA lose a big chunk of money but they were supposed to be non-profit and non-corrupt anyway. there are other ways to make money for instance taxing player sales between fifa clubs (sorry, player agents).
would be interesting to see the ESL run like the F1 - unlimited finances - maybe we get to see some crazy football innovations like that player-cam and 7 referees for every game.
Click to expand...

I think the court will decide that uefa cannot stop other competitions but those competitions cannot be closed off as it would be uncompetitive.

The big one i want to know is if uefa can still have their own competitions or if being a governing body this creates it's own problems. You could see uefa split in two. One body to govern the sport and create the rules, another to run the competitions.

The court may also look at the transparency of uefa, how members are elected and decisions made etc...

The ruling in december could be very interesting. May also effect fifa and other sports.
 
the ruling affects only Europe right? but yeah fifa and uefa may have to be reconfigured based on new rules in europe where the football powerhouses are. but surely a european court cannot rule against a global private competition that ESL is.

FIFA knocked back might be a good thing - I mean as a non-profit they are supposed to have a social mission and recently with the world cup and all its quite over the top wasteful. Imagine if they can divert some funds to the least developed countries to give youths a chance to develop careers in football.

latest i could find on the hearings supports your view :

https://www.politico.eu/article/uefa-fifa-europe-football-super-league-hearing-court-wrap/
  • The Commission’s lawyer delivered a nuanced argument outlining that UEFA could have “legitimate objectives to restrict competition,” but added that “any defense of the European sports model must respect European law, particularly regarding competition law and fundamental freedoms” and that UEFA “may have a conflict of interest when authorizing competitions organized by third parties.”
  • In one heated moment, Judge Nils Wahl from Sweden took the Commission to task for failing to provide clear guidance on whether UEFA was concretely in breach of EU antitrust law.
  • UEFA has a “radical” conflict of interest" because of its dual role as regulator and operator, argued the Super League’s lawyer.

also this is HUGE, according to this: https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/european-super-league-court-of-justice-hearing-madrid-fifa-uefa/
  • The case, which has the reference number C-333/21, will be heard by a ‘Grand Chamber’ of 15 ECJ judges, which is an indication of how potentially significant and complex it is thought to be. Often, cases referred to the ECJ are heard by chambers of three or five judges.
ECJ ruling expected in September which provides clarity according to EU laws, afterwhich the Madrid Commercial court takes over and decides its practical application. Would you think Barca and Real have sway over the Madrid court?

Lilbaz said:
I think the court will decide that uefa cannot stop other competitions but those competitions cannot be closed off as it would be uncompetitive.

The big one i want to know is if uefa can still have their own competitions or if being a governing body this creates it's own problems. You could see uefa split in two. One body to govern the sport and create the rules, another to run the competitions.



The court may also look at the transparency of uefa, how members are elected and decisions made etc...

The ruling in december could be very interesting. May also effect fifa and other sports.
Click to expand...
 
metalgear said:
the ruling affects only Europe right? but yeah fifa and uefa may have to be reconfigured based on new rules in europe where the football powerhouses are. but surely a european court cannot rule against a global private competition that ESL is.

FIFA knocked back might be a good thing - I mean as a non-profit they are supposed to have a social mission and recently with the world cup and all its quite over the top wasteful. Imagine if they can divert some funds to the least developed countries to give youths a chance to develop careers in football.

latest i could find on the hearings supports your view :

https://www.politico.eu/article/uefa-fifa-europe-football-super-league-hearing-court-wrap/
  • The Commission’s lawyer delivered a nuanced argument outlining that UEFA could have “legitimate objectives to restrict competition,” but added that “any defense of the European sports model must respect European law, particularly regarding competition law and fundamental freedoms” and that UEFA “may have a conflict of interest when authorizing competitions organized by third parties.”
  • In one heated moment, Judge Nils Wahl from Sweden took the Commission to task for failing to provide clear guidance on whether UEFA was concretely in breach of EU antitrust law.
  • UEFA has a “radical” conflict of interest" because of its dual role as regulator and operator, argued the Super League’s lawyer.

also this is HUGE, according to this: https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/european-super-league-court-of-justice-hearing-madrid-fifa-uefa/
  • The case, which has the reference number C-333/21, will be heard by a ‘Grand Chamber’ of 15 ECJ judges, which is an indication of how potentially significant and complex it is thought to be. Often, cases referred to the ECJ are heard by chambers of three or five judges.
ECJ ruling expected in September which provides clarity according to EU laws, afterwhich the Madrid Commercial court takes over and decides its practical application. Would you think Barca and Real have sway over the Madrid court?
Click to expand...

The esl is not a global private competition. The majority of the clubs are businesses in the eu and have to abide by eu law. Uefa and fifa are based in switzerland that although not a part of the eu abides by its laws. English teams will not directly be effected.
 
Lilbaz said:
The esl is not a global private competition. The majority of the clubs are businesses in the eu and have to abide by eu law. Uefa and fifa are based in switzerland that although not a part of the eu abides by its laws. English teams will not directly be effected.
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As far as I understand, it’s not so much where a company/business/organisation is based but rather if that organisation, regardless of location, conducts any business inside the EU, then it has to abide by EU competition law.
 
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