ENIC

[glasgowspur]

After a period where they have won the league and the fa cup

So they have regressed after doing all the things the fans wanted us to do.

 

[Gazza]

Leicester have recruited well and have a manager many on here thought was the answer to our prayers, they're 11th and 9 points behind us.

Excellent, but have won the FA Cup and league, more than us under the entirety of ENIC

 

[Baleforce]

Sorry you have no idea what our level is
It’s pure speculation on your front

what are your expectations from supporting Spurs?

that we do things in "the right way", we don't take shortcuts, and that we always think long term

at some point in my childhood I decided to support Spurs, I want to be right

 

[glasgowspur]

Excellent, but have won the FA Cup and league, more than us under the entirety of ENIC

See above.
There is no magic bullet.
And they won the league with a squad of journeymen and a has been manager.
What that squad had was belief and fight. You can't buy or teach them, you either have it or you don't.
Currently we don't, haven't had for decades, and some of that i lay at Levy door.

 

[RigorMortis]

So they have regressed after doing all the things the fans wanted us to do.

Well let’s see how long that regression is, they have had their glory.

 

[RigorMortis]

that we do things in "the right way", we don't take shortcuts, and that we always think long term

at some point in my childhood I decided to support Spurs, I want to be right

The “right” way?
So Liverpool didn’t do things the right way or leiscter?
But you have just said we have no chance and need to accept our place in the food chain, so what was the point into pumping 1 billion plus into infrastructure if nothing changes, surely the right way then would be to stay at white hart lane and not in a new stadium if it has no effect because we are stuck where we are in the food chain?

 

[glasgowspur]

Well let’s see how long that regression is, they have had their glory.

They have, and the unrealistic expectations of their fans that has led to has been a millstone round their necks.
Much like us with the CL final.

 

[billyiddo]

Ok let's just just pretend that we are doing as best as we can get.

Liverpool and Leicester have somehow recruited very well and won titles and cups. Our recruitment is the issue and the way we go about matters on the pitch. It's getting boring knowing our tried tested and failed methods in getting players that we target initially.

Sure there is a risk of new owners coming in and doing something like kronke at arsenal, but the motto is to dare is to do ... we just can't spend the next 20 years hoping to get lucky with Poch MK2 and building from there.

Oh and we are not even close to competing as Levy or anyone else will tell me.

Were we close to competing under Pochettino and Redknapp?

 

[Baleforce]

The “right” way?
So Liverpool didn’t do things the right way or leiscter?
But you have just said we have no chance and need to accept our place in the food chain, so what was the point into pumping 1 billion plus into infrastructure if nothing changes, surely the right way then would be to stay at white hart lane and not in a new stadium if it has no effect because we are stuck where we are in the food chain?

they were doped to the eyeballs, chemically

the clubs that haven't build the strong foundations will fall away at some point

infrastructure is everything

 

[RigorMortis]

They have, and the unrealistic expectations of their fans that has led to has been a millstone round their necks.
Much like us with the CL final.

I don’t know many leiscter fans but the few I do know don’t have unrealistic expectations and have enjoyed their moment in the sun.

So our expectations are unrealistic and we shouldn’t expect have meangiful signs of progression from Poch’s day with the benefit of the stadium and the extra revenue?

 

[RigorMortis]

they were doped to the eyeballs, chemically

the clubs that haven't build the strong foundations will fall away at some point

infrastructure is everything

Liverpool and Leiscter were doped to the eyeballs chemically?

mate you sure there?

infrastrucutre is everything yet you have stated that in footballing terms we can’t compete and should accept our place in the food chain because nothing will change.

So therefore how is infrastructure everything in terms of equating to successs on the pitch if in your opinion we are stuck because of our place in the football food chain?

 

[billyiddo]

So basically we should suck it up?

There is nothing we can do so let’s carry on paying the highest tickets in the land and accept our standing in the footballing food chain?

Take a step back and try to get some perspective would be my suggestion - it's the modern footballing landscape and yes, our position in the food chain that is the biggest contributing factor to the lack of tangible success at Tottenham over the years ENIC have been in charge - a change in owners, unless super rich and willing to invest will not see an about turn in fortunes. They will still be behind 4-5 clubs domestically in terms of wealth and so always fighting an uphill battle to compete.

That isn't to say that they shouldn't be criticised for bad decisions - since leaving WHL we have seemingly lurched from major bad decision to major bad decision - appointing a DoF and a top tier manager like Conte is a good sign that they are trying to fix it

 

[Gazza]

i think Daniel does care about the club, you don’t dedicate 20 years to something where you had the connections and talent to make more money elsewhere unless you care.

if their was a fund to buy some equity in the club I would probably put some money in, but if it was going to be substantial… I would want to ensure that Daniel stays on as part of my decision to invest.

I'd stay in a brick job for 20 years if my pay off would be in the billions

 

[Gazza]

Were we close to competing under Pochettino and Redknapp?

Yeah we were so close for two out of 20 years could have won a few things along the way had either of these two managers had their wishes for players that they wanted.

 

[DTA]

I'd stay in a brick job for 20 years if my pay off would be in the billions

1.Levy’s profit won’t be in the billions (far from it)
2. I’m almost certain you don’t have the ability, drive and contacts that Levy has.

 

[Baleforce]

Liverpool and Leiscter were doped to the eyeballs chemically?

mate you sure there?

infrastrucutre is everything yet you have stated that in footballing terms we can’t compete and should accept our place in the food chain because nothing will change.

So therefore how is infrastructure everything in terms of equating to successs on the pitch if in your opinion we are stuck because of our place in the football food chain?

yeah, either that or pizza really is magic and everyone is asthmatic

we can compete with those who have similar finances, the infrastructure we have invested in will continue to increase our finances over time, we will get closer in future from a sustainable base

our place on the food chain will change too, as we begin to reap the benefits of the improved infrastructure, and as those who built on sand, fall away

ultimately, my point is, to answer your original question, yes we suck it up for now, because it's obviously going to get better, what else can you do?

 

[DubSpur]

I'd stay in a brick job for 20 years if my pay off would be in the billions

The difference is Levy would most likely have made a fortune in a number of jobs he could've taken over the years.

 

[Gazza]

1.Levy’s profit won’t be in the billions (far from it)
2. I’m almost certain you don’t have the ability, drive and contacts that Levy has.

3. I'm not Levy, but we were talking about the motives behind Levy. You only have to go back to his rangers days when he clearly said football is only a way of engineering massive profits.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

The owners at our club are a problem but not Necessarily from their own making

every club should be self supporting and sustainable. It’s just sensible and how all sports should be run. It wouldn’t happen in US sort for example as they get the competition balanced with financial viability

the issue we have in European football (I can’t comment on the rest of the world) is that the clubs that were an extension of the fan base have now become extensions of a rich man’s armoury to defend their reputations. That’s not healthy and really takes away why theses clubs were created (from works groups, local churches, friendship groups and many more)

it’s actually quite toxic and unhealthy for the sport long term but whilst there is money there will always be crooks I guess.

the fit and proper persons test is something I’ve always found hilarious. I’ve had the pleasure and misfortune of meeting a lot of self made millionaires. Not one of them hasn’t brick one someone one the way up. It’s why they made their money.

I’ve also met a lot of people who have inherited wealth. With a lot of them their actually quite dumb people but bank of dad helps out their errors. On other extremes they use their luck form being born in a state of privilege to push down others in many ways, most of which a normal person couldn’t or wouldn’t do

the dilemma in football is that clubs have become play things but fans haven’t. The majority of fans are still normal people who work for a living and use football as a release from their daily lives. It’s contradictory to the owners now in such a big way

leicesters owners weren’t fans of the club before they brought it. They brought the club cheap as it had gone bust and couldn’t pay for the stadium they had built. They basically exploited the opportunity like most businessmen, and now there revered because they saved the club and frugality as far as I’m aware don’t have human rights issues and aren’t criminals (minimum standards) and seem to be genuinely likeable

It’s the same with abramovich, same with the dildo twins, same with the ginger gang at United, and many many more but with much more negative twists as we know

when people talk good owners I think of Gibson at boro. Local guy invested his own money in the club he grew up with. Same with Bloom at Brighton, and Benham at Brentford

Their owners that are fit and proper and are fans too. That’s the real panacea. Owners who love the club, not the status owning a club brings.

Our issue as we know is Lewis doesn’t own Tottenham because he is a spurs fan. He doesn’t care for footy in reality. For him it has grown to be his biggest investment growth and therefore a prize in his portfolio. Levy may or may not have been a fan but again we do know the growth at spurs (and he has contributed more than most despite what people think) has made him very rich.

him and Lewis are now at a cross roads. Do they cash out and take the massive massive profits on their business. Or do they carry on hoping and planning for growth that they can’t necessarily control due to the opposition

as I’ve said numerous times the valuation they have on a club with such debt is bonkers imo.
We owe about £800m, with a playing staff value of around £600M at a guess and a land asset base of around £1.2b. So a balance of about £1B
Add in good will value and the clubs place on the league and I still can’t fathom how it’s a £3b valuation
Id say half of that and the new owners take the debt would be about fair value in what’s a volatile unstable sport despite all the recent crazy growth. Levy and lewis would make about £1.45B profit on their investment which is staggering really

the issue of course is there are people who believe £3B is fair value on the basis of what’s to come bad the future but the clubs future can change so quickly. The wonderful stadium can quickly become less full. The sponsors can move there money to get next big thing. And suddenly the value is less in reality

But we as fans can’t change the owners. The so called protests also seemed to include more beer cans than people. There isn’t a know spurs fan with the £££ to buy them out so we sit and wait and hope… and it’s the one that kills you

 

[Gazza]

The difference is Levy would most likely have made a fortune in a number of jobs he could've taken over the years.

So you say.

Ok he loves spurs ... his friends would tell you otherwise.