ENIC

[Gutter Boy]

I'm delighted with Levy. There have been a ton of these threads and discussions and I'm yet to hear a single solid suggestion of a better chairman. Whenever Enic do sell I hope the new owners keep Levy around.

I'm happy with Enic as long as our ambitions are the same as theirs and I think they will be for at least a few more years.

For some reason I've always expected Philip Green will end up as our next owner.

He, Michael Ashcroft and Stelios Haji-Ioannou are probably the insider candidates for a transfer similar to Sugar to Levy (i.e. they have all recently been significant shareholders).

 

[Rorschach]

The stadium money is gonna come from an upfront deal on naming rights for the stadium.
To get a big naming rights sponsorship we probably need to qualify for the champion's league again.

Anyone who thing we are holding money back for the stadium needs to actually look at the accounts and see we are spending every penny we get in.

I think you are right on this. I think failure to reach CL this year has hurt us more than anyone realises.

If I recall correctly from Jimmy's comments in the stadium thread, the money for the training ground and NDP land grab has been at least partially funded from current revenue streams. Not all of the money was borrowed, but I can't remember the exact figures. So you'd have to say player trading has been affected and our net spend over the last 4-5 years would seem to show this. Maybe this spend will stop this season and this will kick 15-20mil into the transfer fund that was previously diverted to the capital projects.

Delighted with Levy but just wished he had taken a punt in the last 2-3 Jan transfer windows.

 

[thfcsteff]

Brilliant question, and one that is hard.

Personally, I love where we are right now (albeit I am disappointed with how close we got to CL the last 3 seasons)...I feel a sense of pride in the fact we are one of the last clubs in the PL doing it the 'right' way so-to-speak, not spending beyond our means yet able to field some of the finest players in the game. the much-maligned likes of Commoli take a lot of credit for that IMHO.

I think if we went the way of the mega-billions, if we got bought by a Far East magnate, a small piece of this wonderful love affair would die for me. It would be inevitable acquiescence. And as much as I know (deep down) it will happen one-day, I don't want it.

I think Levy has his faults, but generally has been a fantastic chairman. For what he came into to where we are, pound for pound he has been the best in the PL.

My dream is that he has finally got his man in AVB (he wanted him earlier) and that between them, we can build something special. I think ENIC WILL deliver the stadium, albeit next year summer 2014 as a guess.

 

[markysimmo]

No lets fudge them off and get the Venkys in

 

[thfcsteff]

If the stadium doesn't get done or start this year then for me we need new owners. They have the money privately to do the stadium, and with a zero interest loan they could have the money back in 10 years with the current SKY deal and increased matchday revenue. That's without the need of naming rights.

Lets get this right, Levy first spoke about this stadium build after he came under fire for the Jol incident in 2008. If this doesn't get done on his watch, for me.. he has mugged us all off by getting us to believe in the stadium idea. We are talking 5+ years since Jol.

For me Lewis has to see this as an investment to increase the value of the asset. Building a stadium would add more value to the club than it would without. But I get the feeling that like the majority of what ENIC has done, they are cheap and want to do it by others paying for it.. TV deals, Fans, Business, and put zero risk onto themselves. Like the Glazers.. boils down to something for nothing.

Levy is a quality chairman..one of the best, but unfortunately he and Lewis are brick owners.

The move to stubhub is another reminder that they care little about the fans. We are just the pawns that pay for there greed.

If you feel Levy has 'mugged us off' then to what end? What possible benefit has he received from said 'mugging'?

 

[Raziel]

The only glass ceiling we have hit is the legitimate top for a club being run without fiscal doping.

City/Cheat$ki basically have bought two of the spots that generate the funds required to compete for the title, that leaves us fighting against the 20 year incumbent United, Pool who has a good global merchandising model and much bigger stadium and the Scum who again have a bigger stadium, better global merchandising and 16+ years of CL revenue in the bank.

Outside of a Sheik/Russian type buy out with unlimited funds, what could the next ownership do differently?

People think too simplistically

- Easy to say, "if we had spent 40M in January on Falcao/Striker of the week/whoever, we would have got at least 3 more points and we would make the money back next season"
- Problem is, that's not how risk works, if we bought a 40M dollar player in January and by February 1st both him and Bale were injured and we limped to an 8th place finish (not even Europe), how does your economic model work?

It's not a Xbox game, can't press reset if you don't like the result, to some extent you have to plan for worse case scenario.

 

[thfcsteff]

No lets fudge them off and get the Venkys in

:ross:

That would be a fowl move!

 

[thfcsteff]

The only glass ceiling we have hit is the legitimate top for a club being run without fiscal doping.

City/Cheat$ki basically have bought two of the spots that generate the funds required to compete for the title, that leaves us fighting against the 20 year incumbent United, Pool who has a good global merchandising model and much bigger stadium and the Scum who again have a bigger stadium, better global merchandising and 16+ years of CL revenue in the bank.

Outside of a Sheik/Russian type buy out with unlimited funds, what could the next ownership do differently?

People think too simplistically

- Easy to say, "if we had spent 40M in January on Falcao/Striker of the week/whoever, we would have got at least 3 more points and we would make the money back next season"
- Problem is, that's not how risk works, if we bought a 40M dollar player in January and by February 1st both him and Bale were injured and we limped to an 8th place finish (not even Europe), how does your economic model work?

It's not a Xbox game, can't press reset if you don't like the result, to some extent you have to plan for worse case scenario.

=D>
It's only an xbox game for oligarchs and oil money.
Seriously, if we go that route, it will be a sad day IMHO...

 

[Rossi22]

Levy yes. Lewis no.

Best result would be someone buying Enic out and leaving Levy in charge.

 

[Rorschach]

The only glass ceiling we have hit is the legitimate top for a club being run without fiscal doping.

City/Cheat$ki basically have bought two of the spots that generate the funds required to compete for the title, that leaves us fighting against the 20 year incumbent United, Pool who has a good global merchandising model and much bigger stadium and the Scum who again have a bigger stadium, better global merchandising and 16+ years of CL revenue in the bank.

Outside of a Sheik/Russian type buy out with unlimited funds, what could the next ownership do differently?

People think too simplistically

- Easy to say, "if we had spent 40M in January on Falcao/Striker of the week/whoever, we would have got at least 3 more points and we would make the money back next season"
- Problem is, that's not how risk works, if we bought a 40M dollar player in January and by February 1st both him and Bale were injured and we limped to an 8th place finish (not even Europe), how does your economic model work?

It's not a Xbox game, can't press reset if you don't like the result, to some extent you have to plan for worse case scenario.

I totally agree with the first part of your post. We are in as best a position as we could realistically hope for considering the footballing landscape around us.

Whereas the hyperbole of your Falcao comments I disagree with. I think prudent investment in any of the last few January transfer windows would have seen us over the CL finishing line. Obviously I can't prove this in the same way that you can't prove your opinion, but the under the assumption that any new players bought didn't immediately get injured or the plague or any other hypothetical situation, then considering how close we have come to CL qualification I think it is a fair point.

 

[Naughton16]

There are far more worse alternatives than better ones IMHO. Levy has been key to keeping the club competitive. Although an excellent chairman he's a poor director of football so hopefully we get that position sorted for next season.

 

[braineclipse]

I totally agree with the first part of your post. We are in as best a position as we could realistically hope for considering the footballing landscape around us.

Whereas the hyperbole of your Falcao comments I disagree with. I think prudent investment in any of the last few January transfer windows would have seen us over the CL finishing line. Obviously I can't prove this in the same way that you can't prove your opinion, but the under the assumption that any new players bought didn't immediately get injured or the plague or any other hypothetical situation, then considering how close we have come to CL qualification I think it is a fair point.

It's not hyperbole, somewhat extreme perhaps, but a point well worth making.

In January there was a chance of us qualifying for CL, X%. Investment £20m and that chance most likely increases, but it never reaches absolute certainty and there would still be a considerable chance that we wouldn't qualify.

Saying in hindsight (or at the time) that if we invested some amount (whatever that might be) we would have qualified makes little sense to me, like Raziel says, that's not how risk works.

 

[Rorschach]

It's not hyperbole, somewhat extreme perhaps, but a point well worth making.

In January there was a chance of us qualifying for CL, X%. Investment £20m and that chance most likely increases, but it never reaches absolute certainty and there would still be a considerable chance that we wouldn't qualify.

Saying in hindsight (or at the time) that if we invested some amount (whatever that might be) we would have qualified makes little sense to me, like Raziel says, that's not how risk works.

This argument has been done to death on here but the point was made introducing Falcao as a transfer target with is of course is an extreme exaggeration to emphasise his point. We obviously could not buy Falcao. Yes there is no formula or magic player that comes with free CL football, which is what I implied in my post also, but just an opinion that investing in the squad when you have some momentum keeps things fresh and moving in the right direction. So equally you could argue in a hypothetical sense that the right purchase could easily have made the difference. I see buying players as a risk too and one we didn't take.

 

[Superhudd]

If you feel Levy has 'mugged us off' then to what end? What possible benefit has he received from said 'mugging'?

From the fact that he stabilized his own situation by announcing to the fans about the stadium, when all the fans were starting to turn on him after the Jol situation.

 

[GGyid]

Brilliant question, and one that is hard.

Personally, I love where we are right now (albeit I am disappointed with how close we got to CL the last 3 seasons)...I feel a sense of pride in the fact we are one of the last clubs in the PL doing it the 'right' way so-to-speak, not spending beyond our means yet able to field some of the finest players in the game. the much-maligned likes of Commoli take a lot of credit for that IMHO.

I think if we went the way of the mega-billions, if we got bought by a Far East magnate, a small piece of this wonderful love affair would die for me. It would be inevitable acquiescence. And as much as I know (deep down) it will happen one-day, I don't want it.

I think Levy has his faults, but generally has been a fantastic chairman. For what he came into to where we are, pound for pound he has been the best in the PL.

My dream is that he has finally got his man in AVB (he wanted him earlier) and that between them, we can build something special. I think ENIC WILL deliver the stadium, albeit next year summer 2014 as a guess.

=D>

 

[Bullet]

YES!

FFS.

Of course I'm happy with what we've achieved.

Some people.

 

[thfcsteff]

From the fact that he stabilized his own situation by announcing to the fans about the stadium, when all the fans were starting to turn on him after the Jol situation.

I urge you to think that one through. Do you genuinely believe the only reason he announced stadium plans to the fans was because of the Jol situation????????

 

[Whitehart]

I do think for a lot of fans this transfer window is the most important for a long time - I have a feeling if not enough investment is made in the club I can see us well outside of top 4

 

[spurs' magna carter]

When was the last time we qualified for Europe 7 times in 8 seasons? When was the last time we finished top five four years in a row? When did we last have the best training ground the country, if not the world? When did last have plans to build or at least have a ground with 60,000 approx?

To put it simply yes.

 

[braineclipse]

From the fact that he stabilized his own situation by announcing to the fans about the stadium, when all the fans were starting to turn on him after the Jol situation.

I wonder how much money the club has spent on the stadium so far...

Surely Levy hasn't been pouring that money down the drain just to appease the fans?

Edit: And if it has all been a ploy to appease the fans, why the Olympic Stadium push? Everyone would have known that it was going to make Levy and the board less popular. Just to twist the knife a little because he knew he could get away with it?