Director of football-any blame?

[Modric THFC]

Exactly. AVB requested it and publicly stated he was delighted that we got Baldini.

I'm undecided on the issue of a Director of Football as I think it can work very well, but can work very badly. Arnesen was certainly fantastic for us. Comolli wasn't so great and signed a lot of crap whilst he was here (of which Bentley is a prime example) but at the same time Comolli did manage to get us a few great players such as Bale and Modric.

As for Baldini I personally have faith in him and don't think that our signings are the problem we have at all. I think we have probably good to many players at once though and it's difficult to integrate a almost whole new team at once. Just look at QPR.

I did expect us not to be fully integrated and outstanding right now, but at the same time I am concerned that we aren't at least starting to score 2 goals every now and then and starting to look like were gelling. Instead we seem to have gone backwards if anything.

Which leaves two possiblitys in my opinion, either AVB's tactics aren't right or the integration period is going to take a lot longer than I thought it would.

I'm sure Baldini is the right man for the job though, he's signed some fantatsic players down the years for Roma and has earnt himself a huge ammount of respect in world football which means that if AVB does get the sack Baldini will probably be able to recruit some big name manager. The only worry is it's usually continental managers who are willing to work under a DoF so we might get another Ramos!

We had ****ing only 3 new players in our starting 11 yesterday. City had 4! None of our subs where new players neither. You'd swear we were the only team in the land that ever buys players.

 

[indianspur]

We had ****ing only 3 new players in our starting 11 yesterday. City had 4! None of our subs where new players neither. You'd swear we were the only team in the land that ever buys players.

i noticed that too......makes a mockery of the view that our poor play is because of a raft of new signings needing time to gel

 

[braineclipse]

Do you know what mate, this isn't aimed at you in particular so don't take it personally because loads of people do it but I do wish people would stop focusing so much on points rather than the position in the league. We're 9th at the moment and it could get even worse by next weekend. I'm not going to be throwing any parties if we finish 7th this season but only miss out on 4th by 6 points.

Dunno about blaming Baldini specifically, but I don't like the DoF structure as you will inevitably get situations arise when a manager doesn't get the player he wants. The DoF has to work for the manager. It's Levy thing though so you're always going to get his staunch supporters in favour of the system.

Since we're bringing up things that are annoying one of the things I find the most annoying is when people instead of discussing opinions have to retort to speculations about motivations behind opinions.

Just because someone disagrees with you (or anyone else) doesn't mean that their opinions has to be motivated by some underlying bias and even if it is speculating about that very rarely gets anyone anywhere in a discussion. In this thread you even did it proactively before anyone had disagreed with you.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Since we're bringing up things that are annoying one of the things I find the most annoying is when people instead of discussing opinions have to retort to speculations about motivations behind opinions.

Just because someone disagrees with you (or anyone else) doesn't mean that their opinions has to be motivated by some underlying bias and even if it is speculating about that very rarely gets anyone anywhere in a discussion. In this thread you even did it proactively before anyone had disagreed with you.

But that's all people have banged on about since last season, the points total. To ME it is all relative to the strength of the league, 65 points may be good enough for top 4 in some seasons whereas 72 may not be enough the next campaign. Of course the two are linked, but I prefer to look at the position in the table rather than points. Wasn't speculating at all, it's just what I believe.

Sorry mate but from what I see it looks like certain posters back him on every decision he makes. Most of the time I think he gets it right just to clarify. I don't know how you can deny there is bias towards certain individuals. It's not just football, it happens in real life and I am just as guilty of it.

 

[braineclipse]

Sorry mate but from what I see it looks like certain posters back him on every decision he makes. Most of the time I think he gets it right just to clarify. I don't know how you can deny there is bias towards certain individuals. It's not just football, it happens in real life and I am just as guilty of it.

I'm just questioning the usefulness of discussing what biases others may or may not have instead of discussing the opinions being presented.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I'm just questioning the usefulness of discussing what biases others may or may not have instead of discussing the opinions being presented.

Well I did actually give my opinion on the topic at hand on the previous page so it's not like I just said the stuff about people's bias and left it at that.

 

[milo]

Well I did actually give my opinion on the topic at hand on the previous page so it's not like I just said the stuff about people's bias and left it at that.

I think that the point braineclipse is making is that grouping everyone together and then giving them a group motivation is not a particularly constructive approach to discussing a subject.

 

[braineclipse]

Well I did actually give my opinion on the topic at hand on the previous page so it's not like I just said the stuff about people's bias and left it at that.

Not really my point, very few on here are unwilling to share their own opinions it seems.

It's more that it's used as an argument against other people's opinions or as a reason to dismiss those opinions. Something that may or may not be fine, but in a discussion it seems rather useless as some potential bias that could be behind an opinion could just about always be thought of and just about never be proven. So why not instead focus on the actual opinions being presented instead of assuming that those that disagree do so because of a bias that may or may not exist.

 

[onlyme]

I'm just questioning the usefulness of discussing what biases others may or may not have instead of discussing the opinions being presented.

Some may disagree with that.

 

[onlyme]

Not really my point, very few on here are unwilling to share their own opinions it seems.

It's more that it's used as an argument against other people's opinions or as a reason to dismiss those opinions. Something that may or may not be fine, but in a discussion it seems rather useless as some potential bias that could be behind an opinion could just about always be thought of and just about never be proven. So why not instead focus on the actual opinions being presented instead of assuming that those that disagree do so because of a bias that may or may not exist.

Oh, dear.

 

[africanspurs]

nope

he got good players in

Capoue...good player
chadli...good player
paulinho ...good player
chiriches....at very least decent squad player
soldado...good reputation
lamela.....good reputation and marketable hype
eriksen...good rep good player


the entire squad is a good group of talented players. AVB isnt stupid.....we just need to pull it together to get 5th / 6th

 

[onlyme]

We over paid for Soldado. I personally don't think he was the right "type" for us. Jury is out on Lamela. The signs are not looking good that he will play for the team. The same thing is happening for us as happened for Roma. He don't like playing on the left and at least 2 of the goals were down to him not caring defensively.
The other 4 were proper Spurs buys. I have belief in Paulinho..maybe he was a little dear, too

 

[braineclipse]

Some may disagree with that.

Obviously. If no one disagree there probably wouldn't have been a need to bring it up.

Oh, dear.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at here.

 

[Spurs7891]

I never liked the DOF position. There are always reports of problems between the DOF and the coach. I think almost all the successfull teams don't have the DOF system.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I never liked the DOF position. There are always reports of problems between the DOF and the coach. I think almost all the successfull teams don't have the DOF system.

I'd be favour in as long as the DOF works for the manager and provides the players the manager wants. Or the DOF suggests x player to the coach, but the coach has the final say.

 

[braineclipse]

I never liked the DOF position. There are always reports of problems between the DOF and the coach. I think almost all the successfull teams don't have the DOF system.

If you're looking only at the PL there's an argument to be had that you're right. If a slightly wider European perspective is taken there are many examples proving you wrong.

I see no fundamental reason to think this setup shouldn't work in the PL when it works in other leagues. Although at times slow to do so I think it would benefit English football in general to try to learn more from other nations instead of being all isolationist about it.

 

[a spur from swansea]

Employing a DoF means another level of authority to get through to if things go wrong.........when the goons were struggling last year wenger of coarse was getting flak but also their american chairman Kroneke big time,by employing a DoF it will deflect and dilutes any finger pointing at the chairman and owner then.

Why we needed to sign so many players at the same time doesn't make sense,and the players we did need were flagged up for well over a year ago.

 

[Jordinho]

I never liked the DOF position. There are always reports of problems between the DOF and the coach. I think almost all the successfull teams don't have the DOF system.

That's because it's an incredibly easy story to sell. There's nothing inherently wrong with this setup unless you simply assume he's there to do his own thing and undermine the coach.

The vast majority of successful clubs have a DoF. It's pretty much what Fergie has been these last few years with Phelan doing the coaching. Even if he's not called DoF, most clubs will have other people involved in player recruitment, be it head scout or chief executive. It's impossible for one person to do everything and do them all to the best of his ability.

 

[braineclipse]

That's because it's an incredibly easy story to sell. There's nothing inherently wrong with this setup unless you simply assume he's there to do his own thing and undermine the coach.

The vast majority of successful clubs have a DoF. It's pretty much what Fergie has been these last few years with Phelan doing the coaching. Even if he's not called DoF, most clubs will have other people involved in player recruitment, be it head scout or chief executive. It's impossible for one person to do everything and do them all to the best of his ability.

This is true.

It's also true that a lot of times there will be conflicts between the manager and the chairman if here is no DoF.

 

[Harry_Perkins]

I never liked the DOF position. There are always reports of problems between the DOF and the coach. I think almost all the successfull teams don't have the DOF system.

Coincides with the most successful period in our recent history? I don't think this was a coincidence. We had a truly terrible record in the market in the decade before Frank Arnesen arrived.