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Danny Rose

harr1984 said:
Kante left for a club that was going to win trophies and consistently compete for them, it was obvious that was never going to happen at Leicester. Again, the money helps yes. Sorry but you can't just decide what players want, you have no idea. We have a much better chance of keeping Dele and others if we are winning things. They are handsomely paid whenever they go. The clubs that pay the most tend to be the ones that win the trophies on a consistent basis, so you can't say that they are going to these clubs just because they will be paid more money, it's actually an insult to these players and their ambitions. Unless you know Kyle Walker et al personally of course....
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But you can?

Do you think we would stand a better chance of holding onto our players if we won the League or FA Cup but finished lower in the league and were unable to pay higher wages as a result?
 
harr1984 said:
Kante left for a club that was going to win trophies and consistently compete for them, it was obvious that was never going to happen at Leicester. Again, the money helps yes. Sorry but you can't just decide what players want, you have no idea. We have a much better chance of keeping Dele and others if we are winning things. They are handsomely paid whenever they go. The clubs that pay the most tend to be the ones that win the trophies on a consistent basis, so you can't say that they are going to these clubs just because they will be paid more money, it's actually an insult to these players and their ambitions. Unless you know Kyle Walker et al personally of course....
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No you're right I don't know individual players but I guess neither do you yet you speak with such authority on Kante's reasons for the move to Chelsea. We are both speculating. Incidentally it was Wenger who suggested Kante was moving to Chelsea because of wages even his club could not compete with.
There is a lot of evidence out there to suggest that players move for money. Liverpool under houllier won lots of minor trophies but failed to attract the really top players who would move them to the next level, simply because they were not able to compete with the really wealthy clubs on transfer fees or wages. We won the Carling cup in 2008 but it wasn't the platform to success that we hoped it would be and we still lost our 2 best players.

Managers themselves prioritised the league and Champions league. over the domestic cups. Wenger, Poch, Ferguson. They must be more knowledgeable about players wants than fans.

I will say it again, in my opinion players like Danny Rose and Kyle Walker want money and the marquee trophies. They will not stay just because we win a few minor trophies.
 
milo said:
But you can?

Do you think we would stand a better chance of holding onto our players if we won the League or FA Cup but finished lower in the league and were unable to pay higher wages as a result?
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Players always talk about their desire to win trophies. Fans like to talk about players only leaving for the cash - it's an easy thing to throw at a player when they're going to Real Madrid, Chelsea or Emirates Marketing Project but these teams are also winning trophies. We don't offer top wages or win trophies. If we start winning trophies, and there is an exodus still? Then you could suggest players are more interested in the money....
 
Robspur12 said:
No you're right I don't know individual players but I guess neither do you yet you speak with such authority on Kante's reasons for the move to Chelsea. We are both speculating. Incidentally it was Wenger who suggested Kante was moving to Chelsea because of wages even his club could not compete with.
There is a lot of evidence out there to suggest that players move for money. Liverpool under houllier won lots of minor trophies but failed to attract the really top players who would move them to the next level, simply because they were not able to compete with the really wealthy clubs on transfer fees or wages. We won the Carling cup in 2008 but it wasn't the platform to success that we hoped it would be and we still lost our 2 best players.

Managers themselves prioritised the league and Champions league. over the domestic cups. Wenger, Poch, Ferguson. They must be more knowledgeable about players wants than fans.

I will say it again, in my opinion players like Danny Rose and Kyle Walker want money and the marquee trophies. They will not stay just because we win a few minor trophies.
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I don't speak with such authority and Kante, it's simply obvious. What was he going to do when Chelsea came in for him say no I'm going to stay at Leicester and win more trophies there?! Wenger is the worlds worst loser of course he's going to say he only went to Chelsea for money. If a player wants to compete for titles who's he going to choose?! Chelsea. Yes they offer more money, I don't think anyone has suggested money isn't a factor. But unless we start winning things and fast our top players will definitely leave. If we do start to obtain trophies we have a chance of keeping them, without we don't. Simple....
 
harr1984 said:
Players always talk about their desire to win trophies. Fans like to talk about players only leaving for the cash - it's an easy thing to throw at a player when they're going to Real Madrid, Chelsea or Emirates Marketing Project but these teams are also winning trophies. We don't offer top wages or win trophies. If we start winning trophies, and there is an exodus still? Then you could suggest players are more interested in the money....
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Well they're hardly going to trumpet that they left for the money, are they? Not unless their name is Benoit Assou Ekotto of course.

Also - funny enough - the player's agent stands to gain a big fat check with a move to a bigger club. Not that I would dream of suggesting such base motives could possibly have anything to do with it.

Perish the thought! :rolleyes:
 
harr1984 said:
Players always talk about their desire to win trophies. Fans like to talk about players only leaving for the cash - it's an easy thing to throw at a player when they're going to Real Madrid, Chelsea or Emirates Marketing Project but these teams are also winning trophies. We don't offer top wages or win trophies. If we start winning trophies, and there is an exodus still? Then you could suggest players are more interested in the money....
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Big trophies. Regularly. FA cup wins does very little in this regard I think.
 
harr1984 said:
Players always talk about their desire to win trophies. Fans like to talk about players only leaving for the cash - it's an easy thing to throw at a player when they're going to Real Madrid, Chelsea or Emirates Marketing Project but these teams are also winning trophies. We don't offer top wages or win trophies. If we start winning trophies, and there is an exodus still? Then you could suggest players are more interested in the money....
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So can we change anything to guarantee trophies?
 
Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app[/QUOTE]
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Spur of the moment said:
Well they're hardly going to trumpet that they left for the money, are they? Not unless their name is Benoit Assou Ekotto of course.

Also - funny enough - the player's agent stands to gain a big fat check with a move to a bigger club. Not that I would dream of suggesting such base motives could possibly have anything to do with it.

Perish the thought! :rolleyes:
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How many times, no one is saying money isn't a factor! But these are professional athletes and to suggest they don't want to have medals to show for their efforts at the end of their careers as long as they have a big bank account is insulting. I can't be bothered to debate this anymore.....
 
milo said:
So can we change anything to guarantee trophies?
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With our resources? Sadly not. And no team can guarantee trophies obviously.We are on an upward curve and going the right way, but this is the season we need to win things otherwise I think important players will be tempted away. Maybe even a League Cup would be enough for this season, just to give the younger players a taste. But I genuinely feel we have to have something quantifiable this season, more than just a good league placing to show this is the place to be....
 
Robspur12 said:
I think you are both being naive if you think either Danny Rose or Kyle Walker will stay at the club if we win the FA Cup or League cup or even both next season. Money is the important factor here and the difference between what City can offer compared to us. I suspect they want the marquee trophies too i.e. the Pl and champions league.
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No more naive then those who believe that players are only in it for the money, which has been suggested by some. Of course money is a factor but players of any sport are in it to win things, if we keep coming up short then players will leave here no matter what we pay them.
 
harr1984 said:
With our resources? Sadly not. And no team can guarantee trophies obviously.We are on an upward curve and going the right way, but this is the season we need to win things otherwise I think important players will be tempted away. Maybe even a League Cup would be enough for this season, just to give the younger players a taste. But I genuinely feel we have to have something quantifiable this season, more than just a good league placing to show this is the place to be....
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I think that the argument is largely academic if we agree that there isn't much more we can do to win a trophy.

We have a good team, we've got to a final and a semi-final under Poch but lost each time losing out to a very experienced and expensively assembled Chelsea team. Even now where the gap is the closest it has been in a long time, you'd say it was a 50/50 game.

Let's hope for some lucky draws and the other big guns getting drawn against each other next season.
 
In terms of his comments about what the squad needs, I can see us adding more depth this summer however in terms of a marquee signing, I really really doubt it.

Its obviously difficult to define what a marquee signing is however I think it would comprise things like (i) someone who would be one of our top 3 or 4 players, (ii) someone who's proven in a major league (ie Eng, Spa, Ita) over a few seasons or perhaps (iii) an established international with >30-40 caps

I really cant see who we'll be able to attract who is anything like that
 
thfcsteff said:
I would sacrifice them both for big money if their agent/them, were kept away from Alli, Dier, Toby...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
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Steff, I think we need to keep Rose. His will to win will drive us forward, you cannot easily replace that. I don't really care about words. Roy Keane was always saying controversial things but still drove his team on to win things.
 
harr1984 said:
With our resources? Sadly not. And no team can guarantee trophies obviously.We are on an upward curve and going the right way, but this is the season we need to win things otherwise I think important players will be tempted away. Maybe even a League Cup would be enough for this season, just to give the younger players a taste. But I genuinely feel we have to have something quantifiable this season, more than just a good league placing to show this is the place to be....
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A league cup without qualifying for Champions League football will make it more likely our big players will leave. We have been here before. It is why Poch prioritises the league. I don't like it btw I would like trophies.
 
If walker and rose want to go then let's get top dollar and move on

We already have excellent back ups, not as pacy but on the flip side I think Trippier and Davies provide better quality delivery into the box, especially Trippier and he and Kane really seem on the same wave length

Plus I trust Poch to always have us defensively in shape no matter who the personnel are. He has worked wonders with Walker and Rose and he can do the same again with whoever take their places.
 
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