Coronavirus

[tommysvr]

The rise, STEEP rise that coincided with CV19 the point is lockdown or restrictions or ever you what want to call it that resort in economic issues, job loss and disruption to interactions cause mental health issues

Their experts have attributed that to, below is a report two days ago:

Restrictions on social interaction have left people isolated and the economic shock has led to thousands upon thousands of job losses, with more to come.

In Japan, women have bore the brunt of the economic crisis as key areas of employment including hospitality and retail have suffered sharply due to lockdown.

Data from Japan's Ministry of Internal Affairs shows the percentage of women in work has declined more than twice as far as men. At the end of July, 26.6 million people were in work in Japan, a drop of 3.2 per cent from last year. Women account for more than two-thirds of the fall

So there is the silent killer, thats the point I am making which is linked to restrictions people are not tuned into making. A death is a death and for me they mental health pandemic is one that is not being taken seriously enough in my book.

I used Japan as an example because their suicide increase alone (not total numbers) doubles their official CV19 death toll, I am just highlighting issues that people just ignore because you cant see or they dont leave symptoms for official stats.

Back to the UK you only have to piece together the separate stats on domestic calls to police, suicide rates, increases in substance and alcohol abuse and calls to helplines to get a picture of what this back and forth with restrictions following a 3 month lockdown and the uncertainty is causing.

The issue is the country and it seems many people cant seem to focus on two things at once and it wont be till we are CV free that people will start to acknowledge the full devastation of this.

”Restrictions on social interaction” is not lockdown though. Japan has asked people to work from home where possible, but it’s not enforced and absolutely not a cultural norm at all. People don’t feel comfortable doing it.

There is also zero tourism. Until recently, even foreign residents weren’t allowed into the country. Japan has seen a ridiculous boom in recent years, of Korean, Chinese and western tourism, and this was withdrawn in the space of a month. That is obviously going to have an affect.

The Government is now trying to overcome that tourism deficit by encouraging Japanese to travel internally - the Go To Travel campaign. But many Japanese still don’t feel comfortable and it’s not having a huge effect. I have a friend who owns a hostel in Osaka and it’s tough on them.

But that is not lockdown. If that’s what you think lockdown is, then it’s no wonder you don’t believe in it. Encouraging your people to travel whilst also encouraging them to stay home - sounds similar to the UK from what I can tell. But as mentioned above, Japan fortunately has less of the selfishness our western cultures know, they wear masks en masse (by far the norm even pre-COVID) and adequately distance at the best of times.

Lockdown is what Australia and New Zealand (and other countries) have done, and it works.

 

[Grays_1890]

”Restrictions on social interaction”

But that is not lockdown. If that’s what you think lockdown is, then it’s no wonder you don’t believe in it. Encouraging your people to travel whilst also encouraging them to stay home - sounds similar to the UK from what I can tell. But as mentioned above, Japan fortunately has less of the selfishness our western cultures know, where masks and adequately distance at the best of times.

If you restrict peoples interactions by lockdown or other means you get the same result, I am not arguing about what constitutes a lockdown officially the point is if people feel restricted and social interactions suffer then their mental health suffers. That cant be ignored or disputed.

Also what needs to be taken into account is that whilst other countries like US, UK and many in Europe d1ck about many countries are forced into restrictions not set by themselves in lack of tourism like you say or more complex the knock on effect economically.

I agree with locking down but those that are statistically likely to be most affected from the virus, which we have the stats to support who that should be. Like I said earlier, restricting everyone is using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

New Zealand didn’t go back into full lockdown, only one city did and it was only for a short time. They did it properly at the start and they have full stadiums because of that. Therefore, proper lockdown means you can get your economy back up and running.

Japan hasn’t had a full lockdown ever. They’re in the midst of “Go To Travel” - a government campaign to get the nation travelling. Since March, they’ve done the half-hearted lockdown nonsense that the UK has done, but fortunately they have a society who act for the greater good, they already wore masks and had little physical contact with others so their cases and deaths aren’t that highs in comparison.

Certainly, they have huge problems with suicide, but you can’t blame it on a lockdown that doesn’t exist.

I have been reading blogs recently on the so called 50/80 problem in Japan. Fascinating country and issues I could see coming here.

 

[tommysvr]

If you restrict peoples interactions by lockdown or other means you getthe same result, I am not arguing about what constitutes a lockdown officially the point is if people feel restricted and social interactions suffer then their mental health suffers. That cant be ignored.

I agree with locking down those that are statistically likely to be most affected from the virus, which we have the stats to support who that should be. Like I said earlier, restricting everyone is using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

How is 31,000 at a rugby match in New Zealand yesterday "the same result"?
How is 15,000 at a rugby league match in Australia on Saturday night "the same result"?

The J.League currently allows up to 5,000 fans (or 50% of the stadium, whichever is less) but they are socially distanced, wear masks and singing and shouting is banned.

The UK? Well you won't be seeing fans in stadiums for a long time. So which is better for the economy and people's mental health?

 

[Grays_1890]

How is 31,000 at a rugby match in New Zealand yesterday "the same result"?
How is 15,000 at a rugby league match in Australia on Saturday night "the same result"?

The J.League currently allows up to 5,000 fans (or 50% of the stadium, whichever is less) but they are socially distanced, wear masks and singing and shouting is banned.

The UK? Well you won't be seeing fans in stadiums for a long time. So which is better for the economy and people's mental health?

We wont be seeing fans in stadiums for a long time because we are unable to use the key data that the majority of deaths involving COVID-19 have been among people aged 65 years and over (47,200 out of 52,856) effectively. We also spend our time now focusing on the rate of the rise than deaths.

Japans restrictions saw an increase in suicides, I posted the data Japanese experts released on that, just because they are now feeling they can have 5000 fans at the J league does not detract from that.

NZ has done well very well but they will go straight back into restrictions if they get a couple of deaths because thats their focus number, lets see.

 

[tommysvr]

I am talking about the affects of restrictions on peoples mental health? Whats the numbers at the Rugby got to do with that?

We wont be seeing fans in stadiums for a long time because we are unable to use the key data that the majority of deaths involving COVID-19 have been among people aged 65 years and over (47,200 out of 52,856) effectively.

Not sure if the first sentence is serious? They had tough restrictions for a period of time, did it properly and now they're living life as 'COVID-normal' as possible.

 

[Grays_1890]

Not sure if the first sentence is serious? They had tough restrictions for a period of time, did it properly and now they're living life as 'COVID-normal' as possible.

I corrected that, but you are right in the case of NZ and Aus although NZ is in recession (join the club). But having 5000 fans at the J league does not take away the fact there was a spike in suicides with women and kids who felt most affected by lack of interactions. I am not pointing fingers here I am highlighting the effects of restrictive living and the fact there is 100percent a lack of coverage on that especially here in the UK.

Trust me from someone who put in 30 calls a week to staff here in restrictions in and outside of lockdown you get a flavor of the effects

I am not going to go on and on as I am obviously not explaining it well enough, I am saying that the UKs continued restrictions and lockdowns may be deemed a success when you look at Covid related cases drop but the real damage could be done with the silent killers caused by lack of interaction, job loss and financial worries. I used Japan as an example as their death toll caused by none Covid deaths was doubled by Covid related suicides, it was a tale of caution.

 

[Baleforce]

I don’t think anyone would consider the UK’s response a success in anyway.

We have fudged up absolutely everything.

 

[tommysvr]

I corrected that, but you are right in the case of NZ and Aus although NZ is in recession (join the club). But having 5000 fans at the J league does not take away the fact there was a spike in suicides with women and kids who felt most affected by lack of interactions. I am not pointing fingers here I am highlighting the effects of restrictive living and the fact there is 100percent a lack of coverage on that especially here in the UK.

Trust me from someone who put in 30 calls a week to staff here in restrictions in and outside of lockdown you get a flavor of the effects

Obviously, I'm absolutely not arguing that lockdown has no negative effects. I'm living it in Melbourne. I've been in lockdown since March 15, when I arrived back from Japan. Since then, aside from exercise and supermarket trips, I would say I've been outside no more than 20 times in those 7 months. And it sucks! It is absolutely brutal. But our cases have gone from 700 to an average of 10 in the space of two months, and pending any further outbreaks, we are looking at a COVID-normal Christmas, and then a travel bubble with New Zealand in 2021.

Is my mental health affected by 7 months of lockdown? 100%. But the feeling that I get from seeing the numbers drop, from seeing our Government taking well thought out steps means that I have hope. For me, the pain of these 7 months will be worth it for hopefully a pretty normal 2021, which is better than most of the world. And the majority of people in Melbourne feel that way too, evidenced by continual anti-lockdown and anti-mask protests which draw at best 50 people.

 

[AuroRaman]

I probably know your wife

 

[Grays_1890]

Obviously, I'm absolutely not arguing that lockdown has no negative effects. I'm living it in Melbourne. I've been in lockdown since March 15, when I arrived back from Japan. Since then, aside from exercise and supermarket trips, I would say I've been outside no more than 20 times in those 7 months. And it sucks! It is absolutely brutal. But our cases have gone from 700 to an average of 10 in the space of two months, and pending any further outbreaks, we are looking at a COVID-normal Christmas, and then a travel bubble with New Zealand in 2021.

Is my mental health affected by 7 months of lockdown? 400%. But the feeling that I get from seeing the numbers drop, from seeing our Government taking well thought out steps means that I have hope. For me, the pain of these 7 months will be worth it for hopefully a pretty normal 2021, which is better than most of the world. And
the majority of people in Melbourne feel that way too, evidenced by continual anti-lockdown and anti-mask protests which draw at best 50 people.

Been an interesting discussion and enjoyed it, always like to get more than one view on things, hope all works out for you and yours mate.

 

[Grays_1890]

I don’t think anyone would consider the UK’s response a success in anyway.

We have fudged up absolutely everything.

Absolute mess

I read the new roll out of names for the sliding scale of lockdowns here, fudge me, thats what it has come to. You can see them now all sitting there arguing on traffic light colors or calling it tier 1,2,3

What a state. I know I am like a broken record but I really feel for those at home suffering now from a huge reduction in welfare and mental state. I am not arguing that peoples health is not key it is, but if people continue to ignore the welfare and mental health like its any less important than physical health then I feel the cause is lost regardless.

 

[tommysvr]

Been an interesting discussion and enjoyed it, always like to get more than one view on things, hope all works out for you and yours mate.

Appreciate that mate, and the same to you and everyone in the UK.

COYS!

 

[Baleforce]

Absolute mess

I read the new roll out of names for the sliding scale of lockdowns here, fudge me, thats what it has come to. You can see them now all sitting there arguing on traffic light colors or calling it tier 1,2,3

What a state. I know I am like a broken record but I really feel for those at home suffering now from a huge reduction in welfare and mental state. I am not arguing that peoples health is not key it is, but if people continue to ignore the welfare and mental health like its any less important than physical health then I feel the cause is lost regardless.

It’s fair point, that is what’s happening, that’s always happened, there is a mental health blind spot.

My broken record-ness comes from the restricted living being an inevitable low level response by a large number of people. The government can’t talk fear of the virus away, or bring the economy back to where it was. They need to get the virus under control.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

So comparing the UK, or most other places for that matter, to NZ is good, even though they are totally different geographically and in terms of population, but comparing us to Sweden doesn't work because we are so different?

He said that NZ went into full panic, when in fact they did not. They introduced a short and limited lock down in Auckland. That was my point, refuting the hysterical hyperbole. As I said, you can have your own opinions, but not your own facts.

 

[SteveAWOL]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1315398430257287175

 

[Mikey10]

We also spend our time now focusing on the rate of the rise than deaths.

The death rate, and the hospital admission rate, have both doubled in the last seven days.

 

[Mikey10]

Restaurants and bars opened at the beginning of July and the rate of infection remained low.

Schools and universities opened from early September onwards and the virus is spiralling out of control.

 

[scaramanga]

How is 31,000 at a rugby match in New Zealand yesterday "the same result"?
How is 15,000 at a rugby league match in Australia on Saturday night "the same result"?

The J.League currently allows up to 5,000 fans (or 50% of the stadium, whichever is less) but they are socially distanced, wear masks and singing and shouting is banned.

The UK? Well you won't be seeing fans in stadiums for a long time. So which is better for the economy and people's mental health?

Full stadia are not the measure of effectiveness in dealing with COVID-19, they're a measure of the govt's willingness to open up stadia.

There is literally nothing stopping the govt allowing sporting events to continue over here from tomorrow other than their own choice not to.

 

[glasgowspur]

He said that NZ went into full panic, when in fact they did not. They introduced a short and limited lock down in Auckland. That was my point, refuting the hysterical hyperbole. As I said, you can have your own opinions, but not your own facts.

One of the biggest issues for me is the almost constant bombardment of facts and their misinterpretation.
Social media needs to have a look at itself.