Fabio Paratici - Consultant

[Lilbaz]

There's a difference between money and assets. We have a brand asset... The football club.... That enic is milking for its entertainment and hospitality business. Nothing wrong with owners diversifying to make more money, but a footballing-investment man will know how much you can squeeze out of this asset before it runs dry.

And that milking goes back into the club.

They've not taken any money out.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Hehe. World hunger. I know us Spurs fans are famished. Have not tasted a trophy for years, but is the analogy that profound!?

It is paper money. Levy and Lewis have made a lot of money on paper from Spurs, but is only if someone would buy the club at a crazy valuation. And if you look at clubs that have been sold, it tends to be at far far cheaper prices. Saudi Sportswashing Machine at 300m for example. Fans expect us to spend that a year on signings now. Which causes great discontent. The truth is we've only spent over 50m on a signing once before. Maybe because we live in a nice house now, there's an expectation we spend these kinds of figures every window.

Asset value (or paper money as you call it) is all that Uber rich care about.

It’s not having a nice house that should make the fans expect big signings. It is having some of the highest ticket prices in the World that should.

 

[Finney Is Back]

to stick with Apple, this is Steve Jobs on listening to customers,

"Some people say give the customers what they want, but that's not my approach. Our job is to figure out what they're going to want before they do. I think Henry Ford once said, 'If I'd ask customers what they wanted, they would've told me a faster horse.' People don't know what they want until you show it to them. That's why I never rely on market research. Our task is to read things that are not yet on the page."

So ENIC have figured out that us fans don’t really want our team to win any trophies?

 

[Finney Is Back]

It’s not cheating to spend money. At this point it would be levelling the playing field. We have tried admirably to do things right but you reduce your chances of winning if you aren’t willing to spend money. What if we go another 10-20 years and don’t win anything? At what point will your opinion of them change? Do you not agree that they should be held to the same standards as players and managers are? If a player doesn’t perform he gets sold. If a manager achieves poor results he gets sacked.

It’s nowhere near cheating…. We can spend £400m and still be on the right side of FFP.

 

[Baleforce]

So ENIC have figured out that us fans don’t really want our team to win any trophies?

Do we want just trophies, or would we prefer something better?

The customer base is seemingly still satisfied, that season ticket waiting list is still to the moon and back.

 

[Finney Is Back]

it is cheating if it's money you've not earned

my opinion changing is irrelevant, they can't really be held to any standards as the club is theirs, they are free to do with it as they wish, if I didn't agree with their direction and management I'd maybe go and support a club who's owners did match my ideals, it's only football

That statement probably says everything…. I think most of us on here have deeper ties to Spurs that we can’t give up so easily.

 

[Baleforce]

It’s nowhere near cheating…. We can spend £400m and still be on the right side of FFP.

but we don’t have 400m, so it wouldn’t be money earned by the club, so it would be cheating

it’s like in app purchases in iOS games, it’s a shortcut, it destroys the challenge and takes away all of the fun

 

[Finney Is Back]

Do we want just trophies, or would we prefer something better?

The customer base is seemingly still satisfied, that season ticket waiting list is still to the moon and back.

Just trophies please. The customer base isn’t satisfied, it’s just that ‘supporters’ can’t just go and support another club like a ‘customer’ can buy a Samsung phone instead of an Apple one.

 

[Baleforce]

Really, or do you just think you do?

Have you really analysed it, is it logical?

 

[Finney Is Back]

but we don’t have 400m, so it wouldn’t be money earned by the club, so it would be cheating

it’s like in app purchases in iOS games, it’s a shortcut, it destroys the challenge and takes away all of the fun

The owners could release equity equating to under 30% of the money they have made off the back of this club to inject £400m. Exactly how much is ‘enough’ for our owners?

 

[Baleforce]

The owners could release equity equating to under 30% of the money they have made off the back of this club to inject £400m. Exactly how much is ‘enough’ for our owners?

so give us some of their money?

still sounds like cheating to me

 

[SpurMeUp]

Asset value (or paper money as you call it) is all that Uber rich care about.

It’s not having a nice house that should make the fans expect big signings. It is having some of the highest ticket prices in the World that should.

Companies like Uber, AirB etc do have some logic behind their extreme valuations however. They are truly global with exceptional business models. Both don't really have high long-term overheads - just app development - with other people doing all the work. And they can be huge worldwide concerns that a large percentage of the population use regularly.

Spurs will only realises the multi-billion pound figures you like to roll out if a super-rich fan or a more-money-than-sense state concern etc gets involved. Even Saudi Sportswashing Machine only raised 300m when the Arabs came knocking. Football clubs are not businesses that traditionally generate money. Most lose money don't they?

Of course with any entity that has sizable revenues, there will be ways to make profits. But how sustainable they are, and how easy it is to cash in the asset is questionable.

What is our % of revenue from ticket sales? For London, in probably the nicest venue going, our ticket prices are not out of kilter, truth be told. the narrative will fit your bias naturally.

 

[Finney Is Back]

so give us some of their money?

still sounds like cheating to me

Not cheating at all…. Exceeding FFP is cheatin. We are just one of very few clubs that operate WAY inside it.

Our owners have loaded huge amounts of debt on to THFC to make themselves worth more money. Wouldn’t you love to see them reinvest some of those profits?

 

[Baleforce]

Not cheating at all…. Exceeding FFP is cheatin. We are just one of very few clubs that operate WAY inside it.

Our owners have loaded huge amounts of debt on to THFC to make themselves worth more money. Wouldn’t you love to see them reinvest some of those profits?

I don't see it like that, the club took out a mortgage to get a better house

owner investment is cheating, football clubs should sustain themselves or be thrown out of the game

ENIC haven't made a penny until they sell us

 

[Finney Is Back]

Companies like Uber, AirB etc do have some logic behind their extreme valuations however. They are truly global with exceptional business models. Both don't really have high long-term overheads - just app development - with other people doing all the work. And they can be huge worldwide concerns that a large percentage of the population use regularly.

Spurs will only realises the multi-billion pound figures you like to roll out if a super-rich fan or a more-money-than-sense state concern etc gets involved. Even Saudi Sportswashing Machine only raised 300m when the Arabs came knocking. Football clubs are not businesses that traditionally generate money. Most lose money don't they?

Of course with any entity that has sizable revenues, there will be ways to make profits. But how sustainable they are, and how easy it is to cash in the asset is questionable.

What is our % of revenue from ticket sales? For London, in probably the nicest venue going, our ticket prices are not out of kilter, truth be told. the narrative will fit your bias naturally.

You think people (other than ENIC) own football clubs with the aim of making profit?

 

[SpurMeUp]

You think people (other than ENIC) own football clubs with the aim of making profit?

Well that is the point. You can't compare Spurs to Uber for that reason. And when you (often) state that Levy and Lewis have made X millions it is one representation of reality, and not really a fair balanced one if we're honest. They could make billions but its paper money at the moment; with few (none?) willing to part with cash who share your valuations. Even the Saudis balked at those kinds of numbers!

 

[Finney Is Back]

I don't see it like that, the club took out a mortgage to get a better house

owner investment is cheating, football clubs should sustain themselves or be thrown out of the game

ENIC haven't made a penny until they sell us

*sigh*…. You don’t need to sell an asset to have made a profit. All that matters for the Uber rich is asset valuations. If you sell an asset then it is only to invest in another one. Why be left holding the asset of cash that only ever reduces in value?

 

[Finney Is Back]

Well that is the point. You can't compare Spurs to Uber for that reason. And when you (often) state that Levy and Lewis have made X millions it is one representation of reality, and not really a fair balanced one if we're honest. They could make billions but its paper money at the moment; with few (none?) willing to part with cash who share your valuations.

*another sigh*…. You really think the uber rich (or anyone) needs to turn an asset into cash to have made a profit? All that matters is asset value.

 

[Baleforce]

You think people (other than ENIC) own football clubs with the aim of making profit?

yeah, but maybe not always financial, Saudi Sportswashing Machine's, Chelsea, City, they are not there for the love of football or the club are they, they are after less tangible benefits

 

[Diamond Lights]

we had 27 days to sort out Traore. Honestly, an absolute joke of running a football club.

I'll keep banging this drum. We act like a big club when it comes to ST prices (highest in the league). We act like a big club in the amount we pay the chairman (highest in the league).

But when it comes to investing in the football club, we act like fudging paupers in the bottom 5.