Daniel Levy - Chairman

[Jurgen the German]

So who do we sign? Who is the obvious signing to give the players a lift? This German right back could be one, or the Porto guy, but other than that, where is the obvious gap in our first team? And where is the obvious player to sign that is going to come in to act as cover? Maybe Barkley?

We aren't standing still, and we are strengthening. Every year, if the players continue to improve, and get better by working together, we have strengthened. Has Kane reached his ceiling yet? Has Dier? Has Dele? You can bet Poch is working on all of these players to get them to improve, to do things they couldn't do last season, or to have them doing things in a consistently better way than they did before.

Good article here on this, likening us to the Golden State Warriors, who have obviously been pretty successful recently: http://www.skysports.com/football/n...sfer-experiment-will-continuity-bring-success

Arsenal often didn't make signings, but I would argue they still benefited from the consistency of knowing how to play together. The problem was, Wenger isn't a great coach and the young players didn't really reach their potential. Walcott, Oxlade, Giroud, too many players that had potential that never quite made it to an elite level. In 2 years, Poch has turned Kane, Dele and Dier into near enough elite players. He's turned Rose, Walker, Davies and Trippier into obvious internationals and some of the best in their position in the league. He's cultivated the genius of Dembele. He's allowed Eriksen to reach a level of consistency he's never attained before. Arsenal had an advantage when their scouting and dieting was more advanced, but now they need to spend again to have genuinely top players, because Wenger isn't going to improve the ones with potential to get to a really elite standard. Poch does, and that's why we aren't standing still.

So what's your take on what Levy had to say about the state of the transfer market and inflated prices? Do you think he is correct? Do you think FFP is all its cracked up to be? Can you see UEFA actually banning clubs from the CL (the biggest clubs I mean)?

 

[billyiddo]

Did levy say anything about clubs get banned?

Those quotes come from an interview with him and the NYSE or something so you have to read them in context, talking to a load of bankers about crazy spending in football with one eye on potential investment I'd imagine. Makes sense to set yourself apart from the high spenders if the people you are talking to think it's a negative

 

[StephenH]

Levy is a wily old fox. He been schmoozing the US money for a couple of years now.
As for banning clubs, and lets be honest we are talking the top clubs for over spending, I dont see it. But IF champion league TV values drop markedly due to public apathy with the same old clubs alway dominating, then stranger things have happened. UEFA see the Champions league as their jewel in the crown, any negative effect on the competition, especially financially, will be disaster for them.

 

[Grays_1890]

So what's your take on what Levy had to say about the state of the transfer market and inflated prices? Do you think he is correct? Do you think FFP is all its cracked up to be? Can you see UEFA actually banning clubs from the CL (the biggest clubs I mean)?

FFP is not the same FFP that was first introduced and placed fines on Emirates Marketing Project, its relaxed to almost where it was before it was introduced.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...-hopes-attract-investment-European-clubs.html

 

[Grays_1890]

To be honest I don't see what an England team winning a 'World Cup' in an U20 category proves at all? It's a completely different context.

Because its all part of the wider subject.

We invest a huge amount in the Youth set up and have a coach that bring on youth, others spend huge amounts on youth and do not bring them through. Chelsea and Emirates Marketing Project are hugely guilty of investing heavy in the youth and bringing in players that block their progress. This is where the England model falls downs, because we have good kids up to U21s but senior break through is stifled by big money signings that limit their opportunities which contradicts the big money spending in youth. Which is exactly what Levy is saying, we invest in youth so rather than it become a White Elephant we will see through the project

 

[StephenH]

Because its all part of the wider subject.

We invest a huge amount in the Youth set up and have a coach that bring on youth, others spend huge amounts on youth and do not bring them through. Chelsea and Emirates Marketing Project are hugely guilty of investing heavy in the youth and bringing in players that block their progress. This is where the England model falls downs, because we have good kids up to U21s but senior break through is stifled by big money signings that limit their opportunities which contradicts the big money spending in youth. Which is exactly what Levy is saying, we invest in youth so rather than it become a White Elephant we will see through the project

It would be wonderful if youth players doing well and coming through at a top club like Spurs. It would blow the current Chelsea like model out of the water, Conte's rant illustrated this only yesterday. This would bring balance back to the football market. Sadly I think it unlikely in the short term but I would be wonderful for all lovers of the sport. I would set limits of on the numbers of new player per window. Also a maximum spend.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...-spurs-ambition-should-lauded-not-questioned/

 

[Grays_1890]

It would be wonderful if youth players doing well and coming through at a top club like Spurs. It would blow the current Chelsea like model out of the water, Conte's rant illustrated this only yesterday. This would bring balance back to the football market. Sadly I think it unlikely in the short term but I would be wonderful for all lovers of the sport. I would set limits of on the numbers of new player per window. Also a maximum spend.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...-spurs-ambition-should-lauded-not-questioned/

I think Mourinhos rant also said it "I don't have time to bring through youth, Man United need success now" Thats a bad view of things when the house that Fergie built was on youth.

Would it not have been a lovely gesture from the world of football that once it got richer it gave back to the people to make it more accessible rather than blow its wealth on greasing the palms of players and their agents.

Football is a funny sport when I sit here and think about it, as soon as clubs get money from a new deal their first instinct is to spend it, its like the worlds biggest pocket burner. Levy saying in this time of wealth for clubs we are going to use it to build our club and secure our future and he is treated like a total outsider. Its totally bonkers really

 

[demotw]

I think Mourinhos rant also said it "I don't have time to bring through youth, Man United need success now" Thats a bad view of things when the house that Fergie built was on youth.

Would it not have been a lovely gesture from the world of football that once it got richer it gave back to the people to make it more accessible rather than blow its wealth on greasing the palms of players and their agents.

Football is a funny sport when I sit here and think about it, as soon as clubs get money from a new deal their first instinct is to spend it, its like the worlds biggest pocket burner. Levy saying in this time of wealth for clubs we are going to use it to build our club and secure our future and he is treated like a total outsider. Its totally bonkers really

I think that's a slight misconception, Fergies team had a good blend of youth but they still bought all the top players, from the early days such as Cantona through to obviously our very own Carrick and Berbatov. I don't think any team personally can rely solely on youth but if you get 3 or 4 players from the academy with the ability to play in the first team then you have done very well.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

So what's your take on what Levy had to say about the state of the transfer market and inflated prices? Do you think he is correct? Do you think FFP is all its cracked up to be? Can you see UEFA actually banning clubs from the CL (the biggest clubs I mean)?

To be honest I've kind of stayed away from offering an opinion on that, because I don't feel qualified to answer. I don't know if it is sustainable or not. Will TV deals continue to rise? Will it always be this way? Who knows. But what is probably certain is that Levy knows its unsustainable for a club like ours. Will Chelsea or City ever go the way of Leeds? Don't know with their backers. But if we tried to spend the same way, we certainly would.

I think Levy has always had the financial strategy and business strategy side of the club set perfectly since about 2004. It enabled us to pretty much consistently be a top 5 team when other clubs that would have loved that consistency rather than relegations or mid table mediocrity like Everton, Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Villa all struggled. Any of those clubs could have had our place if they were ran better (being slightly harsh on Everton here but they have similar history to us) and we could have easily been worse off had we been ran as bad, so Levy deserves massive credit for that. But there was always a pretty big inconsistency with translating the business and financial strategy to the football side. He thought getting a coach who perfected systems and making a team 'greater than the sum of their parts' would be the answer to us competing, and you can tell he always demanded top 4 even though we weren't ready. Even though other clubs could spend more and even though they would also have high quality coaches who could implement team based systems of play. So the summer with the Bale money was the final lesson that enabled the football strategy to align and have us pulling in one direction as a club for the first time ever.

We can spend more than the other 14 or so clubs and stay ahead of them, but to get ahead of the others we needed to change the game, because we would never be able to outspend them, and that's what is unsustainable. So we need to do things by; developing players from our academy or from the lower leagues, or from abroad where they are affordable and are willing to work on improving with us where we sign them because they have very specific qualities that will fit in our system. That way we aren't trying to play the game of clubs with better finances where we will ultimately never win. The benefits are: cohesion, team spirit, certainty around how to play the system, partnerships, youth players that are affiliated with the club and will run through walls to make it a success. Players that very quickly become top of their game and know Poch is the reason for it, and therefore run through walls for him. Chelsea and City can sign all the expensive players they want but the more that they do, they will never have those benefits to the extent that we do. It was important to change the game if we were going to compete with them, rather than do the same thing, just on a smaller scale which would never work.

When we get our new stadium, we will have to alter strategy slightly. We will have to pay bigger wages. And maybe the coaching needs to alter slightly to account for not having young players on lower wages that know they need to run through walls, but top players on good wages that need to be motivated in a different way. We'll see how that transition happens. Hopefully we become like Man United in the 90s or Barca under Pep. We have a core of players that know the club, that totally buy into the ethos of the club and the manager who serves as an overarching figurehead. We sprinkle that with some stardust because we can afford to do so now and we pay bigger wages to retain the players that have earned it. I really hope we manage that transition well and don't end up like Arsenal, who ended up rewarding mediocre young players with inflated wages. It meant that they had a good team spirit and consistency because everyone was paid roughly the same, and they certainly benefited from cohesion, but most of their young players never hit the heights that ours have done in the last 2 years.

So I think Levy has it right, as it relates to us. I hope we manage the stadium transition well. But I am totally not worried about not making signings. If there is an obvious gap we need to fill and we don't have a ready made replacement in the squad, I'd be worried. If there was someone obviously higher quality than the players we have in reserve that is willing to come in as reserve and we don't sign them, I'll be a bit annoyed. But I don't think that's our situation. We have a manager that knows when to trust young players and when to turf them out. He doesn't give any young player a chance, but he puts the ones in that he thinks can handle it. There's a reason Dele was fast-tracked. There's a reason Winks is our Dembele cover. There's a reason guys like Dominic Ball aren't here anymore. If he thinks KWP is good enough to back up Trippier rather than signing someone from overseas, then I trust him. If he thinks GKN and Janssen are gonna do well this year because of what he sees in training, I trust him. Similarly if he thinks there is space in the squad for Barkley, who can do something none of our other players can do, then I trust him on that too. But we aren't standing still if our squad gets more cohesive, better in tune, and individually they all improve every year.

 

[billyiddo]

That's a bloody good post BoL

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I suppose the other thing to say is, with signings, it is such a massive, massive thing to be; settled in the country, settled in the league, and settled into the system of play (particularly if its a coach that is big on systems rather than freedoms).

Just saw something about Paulinho at its his birthday today. This is the guy that had that terrible scuffed shot at Burnley that has the crowd in disbelief. But also the guy that can spank in a 40 yard free kick in China and play for the Brazil national team. Signings for signings sake just don't work. He wasn't settled in the country or the league (he probably suited the AVB system, in theory), so he didn't show his best self. Footballers are just human. You can't tell me Walker is £50M better than Trippier. Therefore it doesn't matter that City have made a signing of that magnitude and we haven't, as long as we figure out how to keep Trippier performing to his maximum. Is Bakayoko that much better than Matic? Or Chalobah even? Maybe Chalobah could have been an England international by now and a major difference maker if he played for a club that wanted to give a chance. But they have a manager in Conte that says if you want to challenge for the title, you must sign expensive players. We are showing that his statement is manifestly untrue.

When talking about giving academy players a chance, or not giving up on young players after one season, we are basically guaranteeing that they know the country, know the league, and know the system. If they have the right level of talent, they will get better every year just because of those factors. Plus, the benefits of continued and improved cohesion, team spirit, tactical understanding and partnership that comes from it all. We know Winks is settled, we know he knows the system, we know he knows how football in England is played. The question is whether he has the talent to be a difference maker, and that's just down to Poch to judge. Same with the rest of the youth.

 

[parklane1]

To be honest I've kind of stayed away from offering an opinion on that, because I don't feel qualified to answer. I don't know if it is sustainable or not. Will TV deals continue to rise? Will it always be this way? Who knows. But what is probably certain is that Levy knows its unsustainable for a club like ours. Will Chelsea or City ever go the way of Leeds? Don't know with their backers. But if we tried to spend the same way, we certainly would.

I think Levy has always had the financial strategy and business strategy side of the club set perfectly since about 2004. It enabled us to pretty much consistently be a top 5 team when other clubs that would have loved that consistency rather than relegations or mid table mediocrity like Everton, Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Villa all struggled. Any of those clubs could have had our place if they were ran better (being slightly harsh on Everton here but they have similar history to us) and we could have easily been worse off had we been ran as bad, so Levy deserves massive credit for that. But there was always a pretty big inconsistency with translating the business and financial strategy to the football side. He thought getting a coach who perfected systems and making a team 'greater than the sum of their parts' would be the answer to us competing, and you can tell he always demanded top 4 even though we weren't ready. Even though other clubs could spend more and even though they would also have high quality coaches who could implement team based systems of play. So the summer with the Bale money was the final lesson that enabled the football strategy to align and have us pulling in one direction as a club for the first time ever.

We can spend more than the other 14 or so clubs and stay ahead of them, but to get ahead of the others we needed to change the game, because we would never be able to outspend them, and that's what is unsustainable. So we need to do things by; developing players from our academy or from the lower leagues, or from abroad where they are affordable and are willing to work on improving with us where we sign them because they have very specific qualities that will fit in our system. That way we aren't trying to play the game of clubs with better finances where we will ultimately never win. The benefits are: cohesion, team spirit, certainty around how to play the system, partnerships, youth players that are affiliated with the club and will run through walls to make it a success. Players that very quickly become top of their game and know Poch is the reason for it, and therefore run through walls for him. Chelsea and City can sign all the expensive players they want but the more that they do, they will never have those benefits to the extent that we do. It was important to change the game if we were going to compete with them, rather than do the same thing, just on a smaller scale which would never work.

When we get our new stadium, we will have to alter strategy slightly. We will have to pay bigger wages. And maybe the coaching needs to alter slightly to account for not having young players on lower wages that know they need to run through walls, but top players on good wages that need to be motivated in a different way. We'll see how that transition happens. Hopefully we become like Man United in the 90s or Barca under Pep. We have a core of players that know the club, that totally buy into the ethos of the club and the manager who serves as an overarching figurehead. We sprinkle that with some stardust because we can afford to do so now and we pay bigger wages to retain the players that have earned it. I really hope we manage that transition well and don't end up like Arsenal, who ended up rewarding mediocre young players with inflated wages. It meant that they had a good team spirit and consistency because everyone was paid roughly the same, and they certainly benefited from cohesion, but most of their young players never hit the heights that ours have done in the last 2 years.

So I think Levy has it right, as it relates to us. I hope we manage the stadium transition well. But I am totally not worried about not making signings. If there is an obvious gap we need to fill and we don't have a ready made replacement in the squad, I'd be worried. If there was someone obviously higher quality than the players we have in reserve that is willing to come in as reserve and we don't sign them, I'll be a bit annoyed. But I don't think that's our situation. We have a manager that knows when to trust young players and when to turf them out. He doesn't give any young player a chance, but he puts the ones in that he thinks can handle it. There's a reason Dele was fast-tracked. There's a reason Winks is our Dembele cover. There's a reason guys like Dominic Ball aren't here anymore. If he thinks KWP is good enough to back up Trippier rather than signing someone from overseas, then I trust him. If he thinks GKN and Janssen are gonna do well this year because of what he sees in training, I trust him. Similarly if he thinks there is space in the squad for Barkley, who can do something none of our other players can do, then I trust him on that too. But we aren't standing still if our squad gets more cohesive, better in tune, and individually they all improve every year.

Top post mate,top post.

 

[Gazza]

I like the fact that we aim to blood in academy players if their are scraps left in the market. Why are there scraps in the market? Its because we can't afford to pay over the odds to compete with some "football" models.

However if that's the case can someone reasonably tell me why we don't go out and buy say lemar (could be any top player that would improve us) at £45 mil and lump £5 mil in bonus etc to get him?

I understsnd a delay in transfers to allow them circus acts to fight over their top premium targets.

According to the press we have a net profit of around £68 mil this summer from transfers alone. So lemar type would not be out of the question?

Those that state that the stadium etc needs funding levy has clearly stated that the transfer budget is not affected by the cost of the build.

You only have to look at the tv money that teams are blowing away so let's assume that we are not poor bundling in the champions league stash.

So this is not a levy love in or bashing question more of a help me see the light type. But if we are aiming to win things and be competitive surely reinvesting in the team to improve it should be paramount. Especially staying within our means.

The prices of players have gone to rediculous levels but when will that end? Probably not anytime soon until a giant goes bust... but again won't happen as their are plenty rich that need new toys.

 

[Baleforce]

arsenal were quoted 80m for lemar where they not?

 

[Jordinho]

I like the fact that we aim to blood in academy players if their are scraps left in the market. Why are there scraps in the market? Its because we can't afford to pay over the odds to compete with some "football" models.

However if that's the case can someone reasonably tell me why we don't go out and buy say lemar (could be any top player that would improve us) at £45 mil and lump £5 mil in bonus etc to get him?

I understsnd a delay in transfers to allow them circus acts to fight over their top premium targets.

According to the press we have a net profit of around £68 mil this summer from transfers alone. So lemar type would not be out of the question?

Those that state that the stadium etc needs funding levy has clearly stated that the transfer budget is not affected by the cost of the build.

You only have to look at the tv money that teams are blowing away so let's assume that we are not poor bundling in the champions league stash.

So this is not a levy love in or bashing question more of a help me see the light type. But if we are aiming to win things and be competitive surely reinvesting in the team to improve it should be paramount. Especially staying within our means.

The prices of players have gone to rediculous levels but when will that end? Probably not anytime soon until a giant goes bust... but again won't happen as their are plenty rich that need new toys.

It's rarely the transfer fees that are the problem (unless the selling club is completely unreasonable), it's what the player, or more likely his agent, wants.

 

[Gazza]

arsenal were quoted 80m for lemar where they not?

Around 45 last time i looked

 

[Gazza]

It's rarely the transfer fees that are the problem (unless the selling club is completely unreasonable), it's what the player, or more likely his agent, wants.

Fair but I'm sure the transfer fee and bonus could get somewhat around times.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I like the fact that we aim to blood in academy players if their are scraps left in the market. Why are there scraps in the market? Its because we can't afford to pay over the odds to compete with some "football" models.

However if that's the case can someone reasonably tell me why we don't go out and buy say lemar (could be any top player that would improve us) at £45 mil and lump £5 mil in bonus etc to get him?

I understsnd a delay in transfers to allow them circus acts to fight over their top premium targets.

According to the press we have a net profit of around £68 mil this summer from transfers alone. So lemar type would not be out of the question?

Those that state that the stadium etc needs funding levy has clearly stated that the transfer budget is not affected by the cost of the build.

You only have to look at the tv money that teams are blowing away so let's assume that we are not poor bundling in the champions league stash.

So this is not a levy love in or bashing question more of a help me see the light type. But if we are aiming to win things and be competitive surely reinvesting in the team to improve it should be paramount. Especially staying within our means.

The prices of players have gone to rediculous levels but when will that end? Probably not anytime soon until a giant goes bust... but again won't happen as their are plenty rich that need new toys.

Who are you replacing with Lamar and why?

 

[nayenezgani]

To be honest I've kind of stayed away from offering an opinion on that, because I don't feel qualified to answer. I don't know if it is sustainable or not. Will TV deals continue to rise? Will it always be this way? Who knows. But what is probably certain is that Levy knows its unsustainable for a club like ours. Will Chelsea or City ever go the way of Leeds? Don't know with their backers. But if we tried to spend the same way, we certainly would.

I think Levy has always had the financial strategy and business strategy side of the club set perfectly since about 2004. It enabled us to pretty much consistently be a top 5 team when other clubs that would have loved that consistency rather than relegations or mid table mediocrity like Everton, Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Villa all struggled. Any of those clubs could have had our place if they were ran better (being slightly harsh on Everton here but they have similar history to us) and we could have easily been worse off had we been ran as bad, so Levy deserves massive credit for that. But there was always a pretty big inconsistency with translating the business and financial strategy to the football side. He thought getting a coach who perfected systems and making a team 'greater than the sum of their parts' would be the answer to us competing, and you can tell he always demanded top 4 even though we weren't ready. Even though other clubs could spend more and even though they would also have high quality coaches who could implement team based systems of play. So the summer with the Bale money was the final lesson that enabled the football strategy to align and have us pulling in one direction as a club for the first time ever.

We can spend more than the other 14 or so clubs and stay ahead of them, but to get ahead of the others we needed to change the game, because we would never be able to outspend them, and that's what is unsustainable. So we need to do things by; developing players from our academy or from the lower leagues, or from abroad where they are affordable and are willing to work on improving with us where we sign them because they have very specific qualities that will fit in our system. That way we aren't trying to play the game of clubs with better finances where we will ultimately never win. The benefits are: cohesion, team spirit, certainty around how to play the system, partnerships, youth players that are affiliated with the club and will run through walls to make it a success. Players that very quickly become top of their game and know Poch is the reason for it, and therefore run through walls for him. Chelsea and City can sign all the expensive players they want but the more that they do, they will never have those benefits to the extent that we do. It was important to change the game if we were going to compete with them, rather than do the same thing, just on a smaller scale which would never work.

When we get our new stadium, we will have to alter strategy slightly. We will have to pay bigger wages. And maybe the coaching needs to alter slightly to account for not having young players on lower wages that know they need to run through walls, but top players on good wages that need to be motivated in a different way. We'll see how that transition happens. Hopefully we become like Man United in the 90s or Barca under Pep. We have a core of players that know the club, that totally buy into the ethos of the club and the manager who serves as an overarching figurehead. We sprinkle that with some stardust because we can afford to do so now and we pay bigger wages to retain the players that have earned it. I really hope we manage that transition well and don't end up like Arsenal, who ended up rewarding mediocre young players with inflated wages. It meant that they had a good team spirit and consistency because everyone was paid roughly the same, and they certainly benefited from cohesion, but most of their young players never hit the heights that ours have done in the last 2 years.

So I think Levy has it right, as it relates to us. I hope we manage the stadium transition well. But I am totally not worried about not making signings. If there is an obvious gap we need to fill and we don't have a ready made replacement in the squad, I'd be worried. If there was someone obviously higher quality than the players we have in reserve that is willing to come in as reserve and we don't sign them, I'll be a bit annoyed. But I don't think that's our situation. We have a manager that knows when to trust young players and when to turf them out. He doesn't give any young player a chance, but he puts the ones in that he thinks can handle it. There's a reason Dele was fast-tracked. There's a reason Winks is our Dembele cover. There's a reason guys like Dominic Ball aren't here anymore. If he thinks KWP is good enough to back up Trippier rather than signing someone from overseas, then I trust him. If he thinks GKN and Janssen are gonna do well this year because of what he sees in training, I trust him. Similarly if he thinks there is space in the squad for Barkley, who can do something none of our other players can do, then I trust him on that too. But we aren't standing still if our squad gets more cohesive, better in tune, and individually they all improve every year.

Calling @DubaiSpur, DubaiSpur to the knowledge aisle please.

 

[T-C]

Because its all part of the wider subject.

We invest a huge amount in the Youth set up and have a coach that bring on youth, others spend huge amounts on youth and do not bring them through. Chelsea and Emirates Marketing Project are hugely guilty of investing heavy in the youth and bringing in players that block their progress. This is where the England model falls downs, because we have good kids up to U21s but senior break through is stifled by big money signings that limit their opportunities which contradicts the big money spending in youth. Which is exactly what Levy is saying, we invest in youth so rather than it become a White Elephant we will see through the project

For me it's a only a minor part of the wider subject.

Before this year England's record in the U20 World Cup was pretty shocking. In the 2013 version an England team with Harry Kane leading the line finished bottom of a group containing Iraq and Egypt. In 2011 England had three 0-0 draws in the group's including against North Korea. Age group football at International level is full of anomolies that don't give any context for the health of a country's wider youth programme.

Only a minority of those players are stifled by the likes of Chelsea and Emirates Marketing Project buying big money players. Even in the 60's, 70, and 80's the richer teams pushed up transfer fees and paid increasingly higher salaries that less wealthy teams could sustain. The subject isn't new, it's just the rate of inflation that is increasing.

I like our approach, but I don't see any previous references that show a predominant focus on youth development without some big signings can deliver sustained success at the top level. The quality of the pool of available players is too unpredictable.