Daniel Levy - Chairman

[ricky2tricky4city]

Well, Chelsea and City are in the CL final, Chelsea after sacking their coach midway through the season. Which we should have done, but we kept that odious, useless c*nt Mourinho for long enough that we missed out on non-figuratively every good manager available and now are scraping basement bargain bins like Potter and Parker.

Arsenal and United will probably be in the EL final unless Villarreal do the unlikely and hold on to their lead.

We could well see a summer where Chelsea win the CL, Arse win the EL, and we sell Kane to City and Son to...wherever.

At the end of it, everywhere but here, the page will hopefully have turned on ENIC - surely after that sort of utter nightmare of a summer, people will see what utterly useless wastes these people are and have been.

Surely?

Is that your night-time sign off.

Equivalent to a warm glass of milk.

 

[billyiddo]

It wasn't so long ago @DubaiSpur was being almost positive about ENIC after our last summer windows activity - he's then spent the entire second half of the season coating Mourinho for underperforming and has somehow come out the otherside attacking Enic again, doesn't really add up

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

I just want to compete on an even footing with the clubs we aspire to challenge. I don't think there is honour or glory in 'doing it the right way' anymore. I think it just means it takes longer, if it ever happens at all. Even if we had a new owners willing to invest more, that merely levels the playing field, and I'm ok if we win trophies from a level playing field. I won't consider that cheating, I will consider it that we did what we needed to do to start winning, given everyone else has had a massive headstart.

You did think that, so it's you that has changed?

If the club runs at zero profit ie pumps what it can back into wages/player buying, then we will have close to the same clout as our non doped peers. FFP was meant to keep a lid on the doped clubs, but what can we do about that. To compete with them we need a money laundering/sports washing owner.

With increased spending power all you need is a good coach to match. With a restricted budget Poch took us so high, this demonstrates a good coach is vital. Would Chelsea be in two finals if fat Frank was there? I doubt it, and they spent a fortune.

 

[billyiddo]

Honestly how about some balanced views? Levy seems to be like marmite.

He is not a GHod.
We could do worse.
We could do better.

He has built the stadium and the training ground to make us competitive vs lottery teams, richer teams ....

I think he deserves a chance to see what his intent is and how much he backs his choice in managers.

Fwiw it seems to me that, barring one or two posters, this is generally the position of those of us that have been deemed Levy supporters - I'd argue there's not much to suggest we'd have likely done better with different owners over these 20 years and quite alot to say we'd have fared much worse (see previous posts on it) unless we were to have a sugar daddy - but ultimately they need a fair crack at it now the stadium has been realised and the financial excuses of the past are not really applicable

 

[Raziel]

I still can’t reconcile how ENIC get the lions share of the credit for the overall trajectory of the club during their tenure, but they escape almost any criticism and are not at least partially responsible for the clubs lack of silverware. You can bet your life ENIC would take most (if not all) of the credit if we had won league titles and CL’s. In what other business or company does the head of the company not become answerable for the success of the company? Especially given how heavily involved Levy is in the football operations side of things. The company I work for is circa two to three hundred employees, possibly a clunky metaphor but that’s similar to my CEO also running the sales team and being operations director but having no responsibility to the overall position of the company.

I think even ENIC’s most churlish and ardent critics wouldn’t disagree they have grown the club exponentially off the pitch, whilst the managers (Poch and Redknapp) raised the profile on the pitch getting us to the champions league.

Id argue the next managerial appointment is the most crucial in Levy’s entire reign. The club needs to get back into the champions league. We need the revenue to continue to pay off the stadium as quickly as possible. He needs to appoint a manager who plays attractive but above all else, we need to start winning things. After 20 years, I find it quite strange how fans can be accused of being impatient or told to stop “crying” for suggesting ENIC should be answerable at the very least for a dearth of trophies or our sluggishness or lack of proactivity in the transfer market with both incomings and outgoings. We need to pick the right manager and back him. I’d also like ENIC to engage with the supporters and make it clear what the goals of the club are in the next 5 years. I don’t think that is being spoilt, entitled or brattish but I’m sure others will disagree

Of course ENIC/Levy take some share of the blame (at the end, they are the ownership) re non trophy delivery, but why it's often dismissed is

- To start with (somebody did the work, I'm too lazy right now) -> 80%+ of all trophies go to a certain group of clubs over last 15 or so years, so pretending it's not a rigged game is simply naivety
- Of those that managed to break the mold and win a "one off" it neither improved them and as far as I can tell, didn't lead to repeats
- People say dilute shares, get Joe to kick in, whatever as if our investment is in isolation? yes we could spend £150M on players and City/United/Chelsea who already have better squads can spend double (this is why the risk conversation matters, we can't afford to overextend when what we do is affected by others)
- Levy doesn't kick the ball, in his tenure (said it before), we have made QF/SF or finals of a competition twenty one (21 fudging times) and converted one.

Circumstance hasn't been kind to Spurs
- We missed out on CL via Lasagne, via the 4th that didn't get CL, the AVB total points that would have got CL on any other year (3 more CL runs we should have had)
- The delays to stadium timing, move to Wembley when our best team/manager combination was at peak
- Covid happening just when we would have an economic advantage for the first time in Levy's era
- Chelsea/City money doping has been huge hurdles in our original plan to be in top clubs

The club wants CL, the club doesn't need CL

- People forget Leeds imploded early in Levy's time at Spurs, I think it's a lesson he took on (perhaps too much)
- Neither the stadium or wages "requires" CL, the non football activities will either bridge the gap, or if we are in CL push us closer to revenue of very top teams.
- We have long term debt on low interest rates, it actually makes no business sense to pay it off early/quickly

It is never the "last chance" at anything, the only last chance may be for this group of players (Hugo, Toby, Son, Kane) and it would be a shame if they didn't achieve more but that's all.

Levy gave the Trust a regular meeting with him and the board and (in my opinion) they have brick all over that, publicly called for resignations (for fudging what and by who's authority) and demanded to be heard (again, why and what do they bring)

The club will have a 3-5 year vision, but it will be tempered by if business returns to normal, but quite simply let's say

- Be ever present in European competition with an emphasis on CL participation
- Continue to compete for domestic cups
- Become a challenger for PL

What more would you expect to hear from Levy?

I'm not calling you childish, spoilt or brattish but some are. We are all fans here (why the fudge else would we sign up for this), but for sanity my personal approach is enjoy the good days (last game, 6-1 against United, Kane being the best striker in PL, etc), wish for Spurs success but realize while we are not there yet, we are as close (not specific to this year, but in general) to real success as we probably have been since the 80's.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Bloody hell, you do like to specialise in misery don't you. FFS give it a break. Either that or go and support fudging Chelsea or City, and take your pain in the back with you.

Tell somebody to go and support another club is pretty much the lowest form of retort I think. The one thing that unites this oh so merry bunch on here is our love of the THFC.

 

[Jeff Brooks]

I read a lot on here that we don't want a Sugar Daddy and we despise those that have one. So if that is true of other supporters there will be no Emirates Marketing Project or Chelsea supporters jumping up and down when one of them wins the CL.

But, of course, they will be ecstatic that their team wins the big one - to dare is to do - but Enic and Levy simply won't dare - after twenty years they are done - you don't get trophies for a wonderful stadium and Training Ground - those are great achievements and that will be their legacy - trophies (?) not so much!

So at a time of obscene amounts of money being poured into the game, find me someone who will put £200M into the squad (new money, not after sales) and as long as he/she does it legally I'll take it!

And for those who say Levy has invested lots in transfer fees - what is the NETT spend on transfers over the last five years? Probably largely neutral and way behind those clubs we want to compete with.

 

[JerusalemMan]

I think from my POV, I was so invested in Levy and ENIC because I really believed in the idea of doing things the right way. Building something, not needing to win the lottery and cheat with oil money. I was happy to go along with every aspect of their plan because I thought it was really working, and I saw an end point. Poch then got us so close, it was like we'd found the perfect marriage between ENIC's plan and someone who could carry it out on the pitch.

But I think that might be why, the reason a lot of people were so invested in Poch is because he also believed in building something the right way, so I can see how ENIC had people invested in them in a similar way. I just personally got to the point where I think that even if the stadium increases revenues and puts us on a footing where we can spend more, under ENIC I don't think the intension is that we actually compete financially with the other top 6 clubs. I think we will stick to their rules, and while that means the numbers are bigger, it ultimately still probably won't be quite enough. I think we need our own big swinging owner to come in and take us on the next part of the journey. The stadium is done, they have increased the value of the asset and have protected our future, and increased our baseline. Now I'd just much rather someone else comes in to accelerate a path to success.

I just want to compete on an even footing with the clubs we aspire to challenge. I don't think there is honour or glory in 'doing it the right way' anymore. I think it just means it takes longer, if it ever happens at all. Even if we had a new owners willing to invest more, that merely levels the playing field, and I'm ok if we win trophies from a level playing field. I won't consider that cheating, I will consider it that we did what we needed to do to start winning, given everyone else has had a massive headstart.

This bit is key because it's pure hypothetical. Your reading of future events coloured by your opinion. But we won't have to wait too long to see if you are borne out.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

You did think that, so it's you that has changed?

If the club runs at zero profit ie pumps what it can back into wages/player buying, then we will have close to the same clout as our non doped peers. FFP was meant to keep a lid on the doped clubs, but what can we do about that. To compete with them we need a money laundering/sports washing owner.

With increased spending power all you need is a good coach to match. With a restricted budget Poch took us so high, this demonstrates a good coach is vital. Would Chelsea be in two finals if fat Frank was there? I doubt it, and they spent a fortune.

Agreed - it is me that has changed.

Honestly if we do start operating on the same level as our peers, I’ll be more than happy to be back aboard the ENIC train.

I just want success now - I’m pretty open about that. I don’t really care how we get there. I’m very thankful to ENIC that we built a stadium rather than having to purely live off of a benefactor who could leave at any time. But now we have it, I don’t see the difference between waiting 1 year or 10 years to really compete. I think we’ve waited long enough. And I want to start winning things. If it’s under ENIC, great. It it’s under someone else, also great. But I want to win things, I support Spurs and not the owners.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

This bit is key because it's pure hypothetical. Your reading of future events coloured by your opinion. But we won't have to wait too long to see if you are borne out.

Very fair, and if we do properly compete, I am very happy to be happy with ENIC. I may well be wrong. I just really haven’t liked the last two years - after the previous 16 or so when we were pretty much consistently improving and I saw the logic, I think we got some big calls very wrong.

If we get back on track and genuinely compete with ENIC, then great. I just want to win things now, and I think we’ve waited long enough.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Of course ENIC/Levy take some share of the blame (at the end, they are the ownership) re non trophy delivery, but why it's often dismissed is

- To start with (somebody did the work, I'm too lazy right now) -> 80%+ of all trophies go to a certain group of clubs over last 15 or so years, so pretending it's not a rigged game is simply naivety
- Of those that managed to break the mold and win a "one off" it neither improved them and as far as I can tell, didn't lead to repeats
- People say dilute shares, get Joe to kick in, whatever as if our investment is in isolation? yes we could spend £150M on players and City/United/Chelsea who already have better squads can spend double (this is why the risk conversation matters, we can't afford to overextend when what we do is affected by others)
- Levy doesn't kick the ball, in his tenure (said it before), we have made QF/SF or finals of a competition twenty one (21 fudging times) and converted one.

Circumstance hasn't been kind to Spurs
- We missed out on CL via Lasagne, via the 4th that didn't get CL, the AVB total points that would have got CL on any other year (3 more CL runs we should have had)
- The delays to stadium timing, move to Wembley when our best team/manager combination was at peak
- Covid happening just when we would have an economic advantage for the first time in Levy's era
- Chelsea/City money doping has been huge hurdles in our original plan to be in top clubs

The club wants CL, the club doesn't need CL

- People forget Leeds imploded early in Levy's time at Spurs, I think it's a lesson he took on (perhaps too much)
- Neither the stadium or wages "requires" CL, the non football activities will either bridge the gap, or if we are in CL push us closer to revenue of very top teams.
- We have long term debt on low interest rates, it actually makes no business sense to pay it off early/quickly

It is never the "last chance" at anything, the only last chance may be for this group of players (Hugo, Toby, Son, Kane) and it would be a shame if they didn't achieve more but that's all.

Levy gave the Trust a regular meeting with him and the board and (in my opinion) they have brick all over that, publicly called for resignations (for fudging what and by who's authority) and demanded to be heard (again, why and what do they bring)

The club will have a 3-5 year vision, but it will be tempered by if business returns to normal, but quite simply let's say

- Be ever present in European competition with an emphasis on CL participation
- Continue to compete for domestic cups
- Become a challenger for PL

What more would you expect to hear from Levy?

I'm not calling you childish, spoilt or brattish but some are. We are all fans here (why the fudge else would we sign up for this), but for sanity my personal approach is enjoy the good days (last game, 6-1 against United, Kane being the best striker in PL, etc), wish for Spurs success but realize while we are not there yet, we are as close (not specific to this year, but in general) to real success as we probably have been since the 80's.

All very fair. I don’t think you can actually ask for more from Levy. I think he has done a brilliant job, up to the last 2 years.

But I also think it’s fair to say while he has done a brilliant job, someone else may be better to take us on the next part of the journey. As much as I am thankful for the job he has done, I care more about Spurs than I do whether or not ‘deserves’ to see the job through on whatever timeline he is thinking. (And Levy would understand that take, given Poch ‘deserved’ more time given what he had done).

If we win with Levy, great. But I just want to win. And I want the owners to start making good decisions at this top level, and showing they know what it takes to compete to win. If we do that, I’m delighted.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Nah mate. I'll be here at Spurs when ENIC leave.

Whether you will is an open question - do they own another club you can follow?

Don't like it, but it's the only response to the 'support Chelsea or City' posts. Go support ENIC and their CEO of the Year awards at their next club if you're so annoyed.

Well I've been a fan since 1953 and will doubtless remain so even in the grave. You meanwhile, instead of supporting the club you purport to be a fan of will no doubt will continue boring us all ad nauseum with your rants about Enic and Levy. So once again I invite you to fudge off to the type of brick club you deserve - one that buys it's trophies over the graves of immigrant workers.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Well I've been a fan since 1953 and will doubtless remain so even in the grave. You meanwhile, instead of supporting the club you purport to be a fan of will no doubt will continue boring us all ad nauseum with your rants about Enic and Levy. So once again I invite you to fudge off to the type of brick club you deserve - one that buys it's trophies over the graves of immigrant workers.

Ha! Fan since 1953, supports ENIC over the club. What a world.

Nah mate. I'll be here when ENIC goes. Don't grieve too much when it happens - Spurs are Spurs, we aren't defined by ENIC no matter how much you wish it were so.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Of course ENIC/Levy take some share of the blame (at the end, they are the ownership) re non trophy delivery, but why it's often dismissed is

- To start with (somebody did the work, I'm too lazy right now) -> 80%+ of all trophies go to a certain group of clubs over last 15 or so years, so pretending it's not a rigged game is simply naivety
- Of those that managed to break the mold and win a "one off" it neither improved them and as far as I can tell, didn't lead to repeats
- People say dilute shares, get Joe to kick in, whatever as if our investment is in isolation? yes we could spend £150M on players and City/United/Chelsea who already have better squads can spend double (this is why the risk conversation matters, we can't afford to overextend when what we do is affected by others)
- Levy doesn't kick the ball, in his tenure (said it before), we have made QF/SF or finals of a competition twenty one (21 fudging times) and converted one.

Circumstance hasn't been kind to Spurs
- We missed out on CL via Lasagne, via the 4th that didn't get CL, the AVB total points that would have got CL on any other year (3 more CL runs we should have had)
- The delays to stadium timing, move to Wembley when our best team/manager combination was at peak
- Covid happening just when we would have an economic advantage for the first time in Levy's era
- Chelsea/City money doping has been huge hurdles in our original plan to be in top clubs

The club wants CL, the club doesn't need CL

- People forget Leeds imploded early in Levy's time at Spurs, I think it's a lesson he took on (perhaps too much)
- Neither the stadium or wages "requires" CL, the non football activities will either bridge the gap, or if we are in CL push us closer to revenue of very top teams.
- We have long term debt on low interest rates, it actually makes no business sense to pay it off early/quickly

It is never the "last chance" at anything, the only last chance may be for this group of players (Hugo, Toby, Son, Kane) and it would be a shame if they didn't achieve more but that's all.

Levy gave the Trust a regular meeting with him and the board and (in my opinion) they have brick all over that, publicly called for resignations (for fudging what and by who's authority) and demanded to be heard (again, why and what do they bring)

The club will have a 3-5 year vision, but it will be tempered by if business returns to normal, but quite simply let's say

- Be ever present in European competition with an emphasis on CL participation
- Continue to compete for domestic cups
- Become a challenger for PL

What more would you expect to hear from Levy?

I'm not calling you childish, spoilt or brattish but some are. We are all fans here (why the fudge else would we sign up for this), but for sanity my personal approach is enjoy the good days (last game, 6-1 against United, Kane being the best striker in PL, etc), wish for Spurs success but realize while we are not there yet, we are as close (not specific to this year, but in general) to real success as we probably have been since the 80's.

I can’t disagree too much with what you have written here. Ultimately, players and managers are judged on how many trophies they have won. I take your point about Levy not being able to influence things on the pitch, but he should be judged on trophies (among other things) just as managers and players are judged on this, along with other aspects such as goals scored for strikers or clean sheets for goalkeepers or top 4 finishes as a manager.

Note, I also accept and agree with your points about luck and circumstances conspiring against us, you couldn’t make up some scenarios that have happened to us. There is only so much Levy can do off the pitch to influence the team on the pitch, but he could start by ceding control of football operations to a sporting director. Signing players earlier in transfer windows to allow the managers more time to work with and integrate them into the squad. I accept it won’t ever be perfect but these are areas I believe we could definitely improve.

I didn’t say his next managerial choice is his “last chance” but I do think it is perhaps the most crucial of his time here. He sacked a universally popular manager (which I agreed with btw at the time) and his replacement flopped let’s be honest. I do feel more fans might start questioning ENIC if he doesn’t get pick the right man. I think we’re a long way from people voting with their feet or demanding they sell the club like United and Arsenal fans are doing but people don’t have unlimited patience.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Is that your night-time sign off.

Equivalent to a warm glass of milk.

Mmmhmm - should make it my signature title.

Worst part is, not all that unlikely. Also unlikely that even a sequence of events such as that will change the minds of folks here, tbh - I realize that. But then, GG seems to be one of the only pro-Levy places left, whereas there were a lot more five years ago, so who knows.

 

[Grays_1890]

So who is going to the protest on the 15th?

 

[Raziel]

All very fair. I don’t think you can actually ask for more from Levy. I think he has done a brilliant job, up to the last 2 years.

But I also think it’s fair to say while he has done a brilliant job, someone else may be better to take us on the next part of the journey. As much as I am thankful for the job he has done, I care more about Spurs than I do whether or not ‘deserves’ to see the job through on whatever timeline he is thinking. (And Levy would understand that take, given Poch ‘deserved’ more time given what he had done).

If we win with Levy, great. But I just want to win. And I want the owners to start making good decisions at this top level, and showing they know what it takes to compete to win. If we do that, I’m delighted.

the problem is what it takes to compete to win is lots and lots of money.

- Look at City, if they win the CL this year, they would have spent £2B, including £500M on defence and in the process would have beaten Chelsea & PSG (who in turn took out Barca & Bayern), and even with the money took one of the supposedly best managers 7+ years to do it.

Regardless of if it's Levy or someone else, that's a really tough ask to go against

 

[JerusalemMan]

Very fair, and if we do properly compete, I am very happy to be happy with ENIC. I may well be wrong. I just really haven’t liked the last two years - after the previous 16 or so when we were pretty much consistently improving and I saw the logic, I think we got some big calls very wrong.

If we get back on track and genuinely compete with ENIC, then great. I just want to win things now, and I think we’ve waited long enough.

Speaking of hypothetical, those last two years could really have gone in a very different direction.

It's clear Levy admired Mourinho and truly thought he could do the business. I can't help but daydream about how different these last two years could have been, what could have happened if there'd been no covid, finances weren't suddenly restricted quite as much and there'd been fans in the stadiums to exert influence on the team and display opinion about playing style.

 

[JerusalemMan]

the problem is what it takes to compete to win is lots and lots of money.

- Look at City, if they win the CL this year, they would have spent £2B, including £500M on defence and in the process would have beaten Chelsea & PSG (who in turn took out Barca & Bayern), and even with the money took one of the supposedly best managers 7+ years to do it.

Regardless of if it's Levy or someone else, that's a really tough ask to go against

Well, we were 90 minutes away from winning the biggest prize of all. Without (relatively) lots and lots of money being thrown at it. I'd like a few more of our players to put in big performances in big matches. Even this last year it only takes a swing of maybe three matches where, had we won rather than lost, we'd be in a FAR healthier position and be feeling much better about things.
Say, Chelsea, Liverpool and Zagreb

 

[BrainOfLevy]

the problem is what it takes to compete to win is lots and lots of money.

- Look at City, if they win the CL this year, they would have spent £2B, including £500M on defence and in the process would have beaten Chelsea & PSG (who in turn took out Barca & Bayern), and even with the money took one of the supposedly best managers 7+ years to do it.

Regardless of if it's Levy or someone else, that's a really tough ask to go against

I know - I want someone with money! At least willing to invest more than what ENIC are. Quite open about that now.