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When did we last play really well?

Mulletperm

Mauricio Taricco
Genuine question.

We have flattered to deceive for a long time, and I'm trying to think back to when the last time a game ended and I thought that we had a brilliant 90 minutes.
 
Genuine question.

We have flattered to deceive for a long time, and I'm trying to think back to when the last time a game ended and I thought that we had a brilliant 90 minutes.

probably one of the big wins under Jose during lockdown
 
Away v Frankfurt is the only game I thought we looked decent and played well. All the others have had 15 mins here and there.
Seems we're in a constant loop of false hope with this club, as soon as the fans get optimistic they seem to get let down.
 
We've only really played well for 10 minutes here and there this season. Last proper game I thought we were really good throughout was last game of last season against Norwich. Things looked very promising. What the hell happened to that team?
 
Setting aside the question, the underlying point is that the performance today and most in the last say 10 games have been utterly unacceptable

Conte is meant to be a top manager. He needs to be getting an ok/decent squad playing better than he has been
 
Setting aside the question, the underlying point is that the performance today and most in the last say 10 games have been utterly unacceptable

Conte is meant to be a top manager. He needs to be getting an ok/decent squad playing better than he has been
That is really the crux, isn't it? Conte is meant to be one of the best managers in the game, a proven "winner". Would having, say, Tim Sherwood on the bench today made any difference? There's supposed to be one, right? Not an entirely genuine question of course, but makes me think whether being a "top manager" is more conditional that skill dependant.
 
That is really the crux, isn't it? Conte is meant to be one of the best managers in the game, a proven "winner". Would having, say, Tim Sherwood on the bench today made any difference? There's supposed to be one, right? Not an entirely genuine question of course, but makes me think whether being a "top manager" is more conditional that skill dependant.

Because the answer isn't as simple as the question makes out

- Who is the best manager in the world (or top 5-10)? most people would put Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti, Conte on the list

But perhaps the real question is who is the best manager at a price point/budget/squad level?

- Conte has had one good spell with us where the results and playing was good (back end of last season)
- Ancelotti didn't tear up trees at Everton
- I'd wager Pep would be worse than Potter at Brighton or Howe at Saudi Sportswashing Machine

Conte is supposed to make players better, a coaches coach, who is better? Jose was the same, 1-2 players perhaps but as a squad we got worse ..
 
Managers can only be as good as the environment they work in, or more so the fit between the two, allows them to be.

Klopp would probably have done well at Spurs had we appointed him instead of Poch at that time and he would probably have faltered at the same point too - would Pep or peak Jose have fared any better working in those conditions, or Conte for that matter? I don't believe so.
 
Because the answer isn't as simple as the question makes out

- Who is the best manager in the world (or top 5-10)? most people would put Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti, Conte on the list

But perhaps the real question is who is the best manager at a price point/budget/squad level?

- Conte has had one good spell with us where the results and playing was good (back end of last season)
- Ancelotti didn't tear up trees at Everton
- I'd wager Pep would be worse than Potter at Brighton or Howe at Saudi Sportswashing Outfit

Conte is supposed to make players better, a coaches coach, who is better? Jose was the same, 1-2 players perhaps but as a squad we got worse ..
Exactly, I don't think there's such a thing as "best" managers, only more or less "right" managers. The exception may be Ferguson, due to his undeniable presence and ability to deal with problems and counterproductive players. But he wasn't alone, and could probably not have done it so well without his sergeants. Or even at some random club. If Poch could have dealt with the problems rising the months before the CL final, he could have been our Fergie. I wanted him to be, but he wasn't. But he sure gave us some exciting seasons. Heck, even Harry Redknapp was the right manager for us until he wasn't anymore.
 
Exactly, I don't think there's such a thing as "best" managers, only more or less "right" managers. The exception may be Ferguson, due to his undeniable presence and ability to deal with problems and counterproductive players. But he wasn't alone, and could probably not have done it so well without his sergeants. Or even at some random club. If Poch could have dealt with the problems rising the months before the CL final, he could have been our Fergie. I wanted him to be, but he wasn't. But he sure gave us some exciting seasons. Heck, even Harry Redknapp was the right manager for us until he wasn't anymore.
Poch didn’t do what fergie did very 2/3 years
He changed his lieutenants…. that new voice may have been the spark that changed pochs team
Klopp has changed coaches at pool a few times
 
Exactly, I don't think there's such a thing as "best" managers, only more or less "right" managers. The exception may be Ferguson, due to his undeniable presence and ability to deal with problems and counterproductive players. But he wasn't alone, and could probably not have done it so well without his sergeants. Or even at some random club. If Poch could have dealt with the problems rising the months before the CL final, he could have been our Fergie. I wanted him to be, but he wasn't. But he sure gave us some exciting seasons. Heck, even Harry Redknapp was the right manager for us until he wasn't anymore.

Yes, BMJ, Harry & Poch were the right managers at the right time, right club.

Challenge is, it really hasn't felt like Jose, Nuno or Conte were/are close to that
 
Poch didn’t do what fergie did very 2/3 years
He changed his lieutenants…. that new voice may have been the spark that changed pochs team
Klopp has changed coaches at pool a few times
By sergeants, I meant players like Keane and Scholes. There are numerous stories about them being Fergie's loyal eyes and ears in the dressing room, catching and reporting any dissidence rising. Every player had a love-hate relationship with this system, but they respected it. Even Beckham got the boot (literally) when he felt he was bigger than the system. I think Poch was the opposite, trying to be a friend. Which probably suits an up-and-coming team much better than a settled team with hardened non-winning veterans. But that's just my theory.
 
Yes, BMJ, Harry & Poch were the right managers at the right time, right club.

Challenge is, it really hasn't felt like Jose, Nuno or Conte were/are close to that
That's what I miss the most except the actual football, the feeling of coherence and that everybody was pulling in the same direction and had the same goals. Good times.
 
By sergeants, I meant players like Keane and Scholes. There are numerous stories about them being Fergie's loyal eyes and ears in the dressing room, catching and reporting any dissidence rising. Every player had a love-hate relationship with this system, but they respected it. Even Beckham got the boot (literally) when he felt he was bigger than the system. I think Poch was the opposite, trying to be a friend. Which probably suits an up-and-coming team much better than a settled team with hardened non-winning veterans. But that's just my theory.
I agree
Poch moved into his office in his last season for training as he wanted separate himself from the players, and watch them on video. We refused to pay for the video so he was going to fund it himself…
 
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