The Best Album Of All Time - Nirvana v Rage Against the Machine

[milo]

Nevermind is the second studio album by the American rock band Nirvana, released on September 24, 1991. Produced by Butch Vig, Nevermind was the group's first release on DGC Records. Frontman Kurt Cobain sought to make music outside the restrictive confines of the Seattle grunge scene, drawing influence from groups such as the Pixies and their use of song volume dynamics.

Despite low commercial expectations by the band and its record label, Nevermind became a surprise success in late 1991, largely due to the popularity of its first single, "Smells Like Teen Spirit". By January 1992, it had replaced Michael Jackson's album Dangerous at number one on the Billboard 200 chart. The album also produced three other successful singles: "Come as You Are", "Lithium", and "In Bloom". The Recording Industry Association of America has certified the album Diamond (over 10 million copies shipped), and the album has sold over 30 million copies worldwide. Nevermind was in part responsible for bringing alternative rock to a large mainstream audience, and has been ranked highly on lists of the greatest albums of all time by publications such as Rolling Stone and Time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nevermind

[video=youtube;oYnv8upTVZY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYnv8upTVZY[/video]

v

Rage Against the Machine is the debut studio album by the American rap metal band Rage Against the Machine.[1] The album was released on November 3, 1992. It went to #1 on the Billboard Heatseekers chart, and #45 on the Billboard 200 chart.

"Know Your Enemy" features Tool vocalist Maynard James Keenan on "additional vocals", and also features Jane's Addiction drummer Stephen Perkins on trashcan percussion. Keenan has been known on occasion to appear onstage with the band to perform the song. The album cover features the self-immolation of Thich Quang Duc that occurred on June 11, 1963.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rage_Against_the_Machine_(album)

[video=youtube;z_WPcuuRkDA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_WPcuuRkDA[/video]

 

[milo]

Ducks for cover before complaints about these albums drawing each other begin :-"

 

[billyiddo]

RATM for me - one of my favorite albums from one of my favorite bands. pure energy from start to finish - an absolute belter.

Nevermind is a great album also and one i prefer to most the others which have gone up in the votings so far, will be a close one this i reckon.

don't think either album has a track which you'd consider 'filler' and each has a good selection of quality tracks, singles and album tracks included

 

[Baleforce]

this is gonna need some thought, I was obsessed with both of them

 

[milo]

This is the first poll where I saw both bands touring the album at the time.

 

[thfcsteff]

Nevermind.


I always felt the RATM debut production was just to thin; always wanted a heavier 'punch' in the bottom end.

Nevermind was, for me, perfect in every single sense. Sadly, Cobain did not feel the same way, though i believe part of that was some sort of self-inflicted 'guilt' at having used Butch Vig and Andy Wallace as opposed to an Albini (he got his wish - and another fine album to be fair)…


Nevermind, for me, is a top 20 of all-time...

 

[milo]

Nevermind.


I always felt the RATM debut production was just to thin; always wanted a heavier 'punch' in the bottom end.

Nevermind was, for me, perfect in every single sense. Sadly, Cobain did not feel the same way, though i believe part of that was some sort of self-inflicted 'guilt' at having used Butch Vig and Andy Wallace as opposed to an Albini (he got his wish - and another fine album to be fair)…


Nevermind, for me, is a top 20 of all-time...

I agree. Of the two albums Nevermind has a lot more variety, RATM is a bit one note for me (but the stand out tracks are great).

 

[billyiddo]

This is the first poll where I saw both bands touring the album at the time.

who were the better live performers of the two?

managed to catch RATM in 2007 when they reformed - initially they were due to play Coachella as a one off - which we jumped upon as a chance to see a band we only got in to after they split up. only to return home from the States to find out they had been signed up to play Reading/Leeds festival :lol:

 

[milo]

who were the better live performers of the two?

managed to catch RATM in 2007 when they reformed - initially they were due to play Coachella as a one off - which we jumped upon as a chance to see a band we only got in to after they split up. only to return home from the States to find out they had been signed up to play Reading/Leeds festival :lol:

I saw Nirvana twice (once before, once after Nevermind) and RATM once. I thought that Nirvana were the better of the two because there was more variety and texture to their music/performance and Combain had real star quality.

 

[El Guepardo]

A good battle between two excellent albums but, for me, the winner is Nevermind by Nirvana.

I own both albums, as I'm sure that most of you do too, and Nirvana has had more air play over time.

I can listen to Nevermind whatever mood I'm in, I can't say the same for the RATM album.

 

[billyiddo]

i guess that it is a valid point in that Nevermind is the far more diverse album, however does that make it a better album?

 

[milo]

i guess that it is a valid point in that Nevermind is the far more diverse album, however does that make it a better album?

For me it does. I look for an album that flows well (one of the arguments I would (should) have made in favour of the Stone Roses is that it is bookended so well by a brilliant opener and closer and if you listen to it on vinyl (as everybody should) each half of the album ends and starts brilliantly. An important part of this for me is having a variety and richness in tone. For me, albums that are similar in tone throughout do not hold up to repeated listens.

 

[billyiddo]

not so sure the vinyl argument is valid for albums released in the modern day tbh as the primary release will be on CD and vinyl as an after thought.

even still splitting the 10 tracks of RATM in two you get

Bombtrack
Killing in the Name
Take the Power Back
Settle for Nothing
Bullet in the Head

Know Your Enemy
Wake Up
Fistful of Steel
Township Rebellion
Freedom

each of the two possible halves bookend by very strong tracks, especially Bullet in the Head (which seeing performed live is for my money the best live track ive ever seen/heard) to round off 'side 1' and Know Your Enemy to kick off 'side 2'


i personally don't think the album suffers through not being very varied as the pace and power never falters, it would if there was a slip in quality but they hold it up throughout. RATM as a band have their sound and they stick too it, personally this criticism doesn't really seem fair as it's not something you'd expect from them, you know what you're getting - you either like the sound or you don't. but fair play for differing opinions

 

[milo]

not so sure the vinyl argument is valid for albums released in the modern day tbh as the primary release will be on CD and vinyl as an after thought.

even still splitting the 10 tracks of RATM in two you get

Bombtrack
Killing in the Name
Take the Power Back
Settle for Nothing
Bullet in the Head

Know Your Enemy
Wake Up
Fistful of Steel
Township Rebellion
Freedom

each of the two possible halves bookend by very strong tracks, especially Bullet in the Head (which seeing performed live is for my money the best live track ive ever seen/heard) to round off 'side 1' and Know Your Enemy to kick off 'side 2'


i personally don't think the album suffers through not being very varied as the pace and power never falters, it would if there was a slip in quality but they hold it up throughout. RATM as a band have their sound and they stick too it, personally this criticism doesn't really seem fair as it's not something you'd expect from them, you know what you're getting - you either like the sound or you don't. but fair play for differing opinions

I was being facetious about vinyl (although it is also true ).

I think that the pace and power never faulting on RATM is a weakness not a strength, I like sunshine and shade on an album. I also think that it is a bit patchy outside of the singles which leaves the second half of the album a bit lacking.

 

[Superted]

I've got a confession to make. I've never owned Nevermind. Ive borrowed it off mates a few times and have heard all the tracks a few times at some stage of my life, but it's never been something I've been compelled to get. Does nothing for me and today the stand out tracks are lame.

RATM on the other hand still kicks you on the nada as hard as it did when I first listened to it. It's one of those albums I won't listen to for a long time, then put on and go "geez this is fuvking good"

Disagree about the production, it was produced perfectly. It's raw, it's an awesome under-rated rhythm section, a completely unique guitarist and an angry man with a mic.

Hands down, end the thread, golden pass to the semis for RATM.

 

[billyiddo]

well you better vote Ted cos as it stands im down 4-1 atm !

 

[Superted]

I think that the pace and power never faulting on RATM is a weakness not a strength, I like sunshine and shade on an album. I also think that it is a bit patchy outside of the singles which leaves the second half of the album a bit lacking.

the variance happens within songs. Freedom, Bullet in the head, know your enemy, etc all have peaks and troughs and I agree it's usually what makes great music.

What I don't like is an album that has a token slow track. It just reaks of a band trying to do what they think an album needs to be complete.

I gave huge respect for bands who just stick to what they do best.

 

[Baleforce]

if we were doing this the other way round and the question was, which of these albums could you live with never hearing again? there is no way RATM could be the answer

i love nevermind, its genuinely one of the greatest albums ever made, but its just ever so slightly inferior to RATM imo, like superted, i want to be kicked in the balls by an album, nevermind comes out swinging sure, but then it kinda apologises, before getting stuck in again and eventually lamenting its anger issue, Rage on the other hand, knocks you to the floor, then kicks harder and harder whilst pointing out that its all being done for you own good

 

[El Guepardo]

So basically, Rage Against the Machine is better...because it's more hardcore?

And for me, I want music that I can listen to and get more than just hardcore anger issues. Nirvana offers more than that for me.

 

[billyiddo]

i don't think that's the argument being put forward El Guepardo - i think it's more a case that the album doesn't suffer from 'not being varied' because of the style of music.

i suppose there's an inherent flaw with comparing albums across different genres in that you look out for different things - metal/heavy metal albums have a different approach to them than say rock/indie ones.