Are we bigger than...?

[AberYid]

We're a BIG club, Spurs are not a massive club, not a huge club, but a big club. We have high revenue for a non Champions League club. We have a 30m euro record signing, we've signed Valencia, Corinthians, Ajax and Roma's best players in one transfer window.

Are we bigger than Valencia?
Are we bigger than Ajax?
Roma? Liverpool?

How big ARE Spurs? Are we bigger than Bremen? Schalke?

What do you guys think? We're not the elite - yet - but where are we?

 

[Spursalot]

Er... Do we really care?


I mean I'm going to support spurs no matter who is bigger than us... So why does it matter?

 

[SpurMeUp]

We do have a big ****.

aka ****erel.

 

[AberYid]

Er... Do we really care?


I mean I'm going to support spurs no matter who is bigger than us... So why does it matter?

Because it's something football fans have debated for years and will continue to debate for years to come.

How much does history count for? If we bring ours up to support our claims of being a big club, why lambaste Liverpool for the same?


Oh an Spursalot - if it doesn't interest you, you don't have to comment. Just throwing it out there.

 

[Spursalot]

Because it's something football fans have debated for years and will continue to debate for years to come.

How much does history count for? If we bring ours up to support our claims of being a big club, why lambaste Liverpool for the same?


Oh an Spursalot - if it doesn't interest you, you don't have to comment. Just throwing it out there.

And it's a debate that will never actually have an answer as football is ever changing and fluid.


**** them. That's what I say. I'm a proud yid, I'm not going to give a **** if they think they're 'bigger' than spurs because I'm Tottenham 'til I die.


But if you want to measure dingdongs then sure, go ahead. I just don't see what it gains you.

 

[scaramanga]

And it's a debate that will never actually have an answer as football is ever changing and fluid.


**** them. That's what I say. I'm a proud yid, I'm not going to give a **** if they think they're 'bigger' than spurs because I'm Tottenham 'til I die.


But if you want to measure dingdongs then sure, go ahead. I just don't see what it gains you.

It gains you overseas revenue, increased sponsorship deals, etc.

Fairly important in the modern game.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Why do players always insist they`ve signed for a `big club`, even while holding up a Rochdale/S****horpe/Accrington jersey? It makes fans feel good, that's why. It reaffirms their decision (willing or otherwise) to continue supporting their club once they came of age and could make a rational decision on the matter. That's why 'big club' debates are important.

Still, every single football club on the face of the planet is a 'big club' by their own supporters' standards, and we're no different. To be what football terms 'big' requires consensus among the other sets of fans, not our own, since we'll all inevitably skew any debate in our favour, being biased.

The facts are these: we have not won the league since 1961, we have a history of seeking to entertain over seeking to triumph by any means possible, we are probably the 6th/7th biggest club in England when it comes to number of trophies won, with the 8th largest fanbase among English clubs, we are based in a dumpy area, we have a relatively small stadium compared to our immediate rivals and we currently have a squad packed to the gills with international talent, funded by the sale of our best player.

Now, whether all those facts together equate to us being a 'big' club is entirely subjective, based on the position of the evaluator's own club, his or her personal preferences, their weighting of 'history' over modernity, etcetera, etcetera.

For what it's worth, I think we are a big club. The biggest club in the world. And that's the way it is supposed to be, now and forever more. Sure, I'll adopt a far more rational stance when thinking about possible transfers and funding and management changes, but in my heart and in my dealings with other fans, my belief is that we are the biggest and best club the world has ever known. And I suspect I would feel the same way even if I supported Bournemouth.

 

[jpp]

Tottenham have the potential to be as big as almost any club. A bit of history but consider this........Barcelona didn't win a trophy in Europe till 1979. Manchester United were a large English club that had not won a title in over 20 years before SAF joined. Chelsea were a second division team for much of the eighties. Emirates Marketing Project knocked around the lower echelons of the Premiership and as far down as league two pre Abu Dhabi.
Tottenham, of all the English clubs in the last 20 years, are the biggest underachievers. There is no reason why, after a period of sustained improvement (which we are in the middle of now) that Tottenham cannot reach the level that MUFC have reached under Ferguson. Do you doubt it? Well I remember a certain Paul Gascoigne joining THFC above United in 1988. It did happen and can happen again.

 

[Libero]

Why do players always insist they`ve signed for a `big club`, even while holding up a Rochdale/S****horpe/Accrington jersey? It makes fans feel good, that's why. It reaffirms their decision (willing or otherwise) to continue supporting their club once they came of age and could make a rational decision on the matter. That's why 'big club' debates are important.

Still, every single football club on the face of the planet is a 'big club' by their own supporters' standards, and we're no different. To be what football terms 'big' requires consensus among the other sets of fans, not our own, since we'll all inevitably skew any debate in our favour, being biased.

The facts are these: we have not won the league since 1961, we have a history of seeking to entertain over seeking to triumph by any means possible, we are probably the 6th/7th biggest club in England when it comes to number of trophies won, with the 8th largest fanbase among English clubs, we are based in a dumpy area, we have a relatively small stadium compared to our immediate rivals and we currently have a squad packed to the gills with international talent, funded by the sale of our best player.

Now, whether all those facts together equate to us being a 'big' club is entirely subjective, based on the position of the evaluator's own club, his or her personal preferences, their weighting of 'history' over modernity, etcetera, etcetera.

For what it's worth, I think we are a big club. The biggest club in the world. And that's the way it is supposed to be, now and forever more. Sure, I'll adopt a far more rational stance when thinking about possible transfers and funding and management changes, but in my heart and in my dealings with other fans, my belief is that we are the biggest and best club the world has ever known. And I suspect I would feel the same way even if I supported Bournemouth.

We are actually joint 5th biggest club in England in terms of trophies won. Only Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea have won more than us across their history domestically and in continental terms. We have won 24 major trophies as have Everton. These stats is even giving Arsenal the Inter Cities Fairs Trophy and Aston Villa the Intertoto and Chelsea the Full Members Cup whereas we haven't won those 'minor' trophies. So if you concentrated just purely on the 3 trophies + Charity Shield here in England and the european/continental trophies available, we are the 4th biggest side in the country.

It really is an entirely subjective argument and you can't just look at stats to make a decision. Whilst Everton have won the same amount of trophies, a lot of those were well before the war but then they have been league champions 2-3 times quite recently whilst we havent. Same with Villa - they have won 23 major trophies with a few of those being in the 19th century and they have been relegated a couple of times in the last 30 years but they have won a European Cup in that time and the League so its all open to debate.

What I would say in our favour of the argument for Spurs is that support wise in the UK we are definitely replacing Chelsea in terms of the 4 biggest clubs defined by trophies although worldwide support they probably have a slightly bigger fanbase due to their recent successes. We regularly draw in big commercial contracts for sponsorship so we obviously garner quite a bit of coverage as a club when you compare us to Everton/Aston Villa. Given our recent history (last 20 years) being quite bleak by the clubs previous standards, we are about right in terms of being the 4th/5th biggest club in the country when everything is considered such as history, recent success, fanbase, commercial appeal, attraction of iconic players etc.

I don't think you can deny that overall Man Utd, Liverpool and Arsenal are bigger clubs than Tottenham although I would say that we are only far behind Liverpool and Arsenal in trophy count and worldwide fanbase, not other areas. As far as I am concerned, everything considered, Spurs are the 4th Biggest side currently iin this country despite the disadvantages that we face and have faced in the last couple of decades.

 

[metalgear]

bigger than [insert measurable criteria] please. otherwise it would become a question of judgement and faith (or delusion).

 

[SWP29]

For what it's worth, I reckon you are a bigger club than us (Emirates Marketing Project, for those not familiar with me). However, to echo the sentiments of previous posters, who is really that bothered? Does it help you sleep at night knowing that you are one of the 10 biggest clubs in the country? Because I am telling you this: as soon as you win that first title in X years (and it's coming soon), you couldn't care less. You can try and belittle my club as much as you want, and tell me that my club's "history" doesn't warrant success (just like how Arsenal fans will do to you and your two league titles), but it really won't matter to you one jot. I'm jealous of you lot really, because nothing in the world will beat you winning that first league title in however-many-years-it-is.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Deloitte Football Money League 2013

Real Madrid. €512.6m
FC Barcelona. €483m
Manchester United. €395.9m
Bayern Munich. €368.4m
Chelsea. €322.6m
Arsenal. €290.3m
Emirates Marketing Project. €285.6m
AC Milan. €256.9m
Liverpool. €233.2m
Juventus. €195.4m
Borussia Dortmund. €189.1m
Internazionale. €185.9m
Tottenham Hotspur. €178.2m
Schalke 04. €174.5m
Napoli. €148.4m
Olympique de Marseille. €135.7m
Olympique Lyonnais. €131.9m
Hamburger SV. €121.1m
AS Roma. €115.9m
Saudi Sportswashing Machine. €115.3m

.................................................................



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_football_clubs_in_England_by_major_honours_won

.................................................................

http://www.uefa.com/memberassociations/uefarankings/club/index.html

 

[greatwhitenorf]

For what it's worth, I reckon you are a bigger club than us (Emirates Marketing Project, for those not familiar with me). However, to echo the sentiments of previous posters, who is really that bothered? Does it help you sleep at night knowing that you are one of the 10 biggest clubs in the country? Because I am telling you this: as soon as you win that first title in X years (and it's coming soon), you couldn't care less. You can try and belittle my club as much as you want, and tell me that my club's "history" doesn't warrant success (just like how Arsenal fans will do to you and your two league titles), but it really won't matter to you one jot. I'm jealous of you lot really, because nothing in the world will beat you winning that first league title in however-many-years-it-is.

A very worthwhile observation. Thanks.

We're traditionally bobbing around the 15th-richest club mark year in-year out, with CL revenue being the one factor that takes us up a few notches or down a peg or two. We're not likely to drop much below that for any length of time. The new stadium will make the club's future rankings rise.

As for domestic support, The Telegraph had a survey done about 2-3 years back and we were shown to have a level of support equal to Arsenal's, with only ManU and Liverpool enjoying greater numbers of English fans. Internationally, of course, we're dwarfed by the support enjoyed by Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal and even Chelsea, sadly.

But our recent form, including the wonderful run in CL and Gareth Bale's presence, has given us an elevated profile that could easily be sustained with a few more good seasons and another run or two in CL. We're emerging amongst the young, attention-deficit, history-bereft global audience as a watchable club, much like Dortmund have of late.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

It's all relative to many factors and a shifting position. When I first went to football Wolves, Sheff. Wed, Rangers, Honved, Moscow Dynamos, Benfica, Eintrach Frankfurt and Koln where BIG teams, where are they now?

 

[We are Tottenham]

We're a BIG club, Spurs are not a massive club, not a huge club, but a big club. We have high revenue for a non Champions League club. We have a 30m euro record signing, we've signed Valencia, Corinthians, Ajax and Roma's best players in one transfer window.

Are we bigger than Valencia?
Are we bigger than Ajax?
Roma? Liverpool?

How big ARE Spurs? Are we bigger than Bremen? Schalke?

What do you guys think? We're not the elite - yet - but where are we?

ow big a club is..


the fan base indicates how big a club is..therfore currently you could say manure are..

however ..people cannot just turn up on match days anymore and watch the game..leaving many fans who

leaving many unable to see the club they support.

Going by that..and not all the hype advertising and money..spurs were by far the biggest fan based club in London..

But we made White Hart lane incredibly smaller over the years...even the new WHL will lack our true potenial at the turnstiles!!!!!!!!!!!

Unless its its 65k plus..

Modern fans always think that there ground should be packed out every week...it all depends how well the team is playing.

Inter and AC Milan have 80000 IIRC..but hardly ever full..

One of our problems is that hardley any Spurs fans now live in Tottenham,,,,therv'e all scarpered...................now that has a huge impact on local fan base.

 

[We are Tottenham]

Tottenham have the potential to be as big as almost any club. A bit of history but consider this........Barcelona didn't win a trophy in Europe till 1979. Manchester United were a large English club that had not won a title in over 20 years before SAF joined. Chelsea were a second division team for much of the eighties. Emirates Marketing Project knocked around the lower echelons of the Premiership and as far down as league two pre Abu Dhabi.
Tottenham, of all the English clubs in the last 20 years, are the biggest underachievers. There is no reason why, after a period of sustained improvement (which we are in the middle of now) that Tottenham cannot reach the level that MUFC have reached under Ferguson. Do you doubt it? Well I remember a certain Paul Gascoigne joining THFC above United in 1988. It did happen and can happen again.

yeah...and I'll never forget it! **** had 3 thousand fans for a home league game late sixties ..memeory fails me..maybe early seventies..anyway.

3 ******** thousand for a home game...LOL......:lol:

They lost 0-3....to Southampton....maybe someone who can retrieve stats, can find it.....

I think the **** must have covered it up..as I can never find that statistic..

 

[We are Tottenham]

yeah...and I'll never forget it! **** had 3 thousand fans for a home league game late sixties ..memeory fails me..maybe early seventies..anyway.

3 ******** thousand for a home game...LOL......:lol:

They lost 0-3....to Southampton....maybe someone who can retrieve stats, can find it.....

I think the **** must have covered it up..as I can never find that statistic..

PS..I am refering to our scummy neighbours...lol...

 

[shd]

It solely depends on what you consider big. Money, trophies, fanbase, tradition. I'd say it's a combination of everything, but mostly depends on how old you are. When i was a kid the likes of Feyenoord, Steaua Buchurest and even Parma were "big" strong clubs, barely mentioned with respect these days. So that would put money as being top of the list.

Then you have Glasgow and to a much lesser extent Celtic or Ajax, clubs i consider way up there as being big, but have lost or are loosing the money game. It's very subjective, this

 

[Spur of the moment]

yeah...and I'll never forget it! **** had 3 thousand fans for a home league game late sixties ..memeory fails me..maybe early seventies..anyway.

3 ******** thousand for a home game...LOL......:lol:

They lost 0-3....to Southampton....maybe someone who can retrieve stats, can find it.....

I think the **** must have covered it up..as I can never find that statistic..

It was actually around 4,500, I remember being amazed at the time!

[h=1]Lowest attendance for Leeds loss[/h]Lowest attendance for a competitive game 5 May 1966

The lowest attendance for a competitive men's game at Highbury took place on May 5, 1966.

A mere 4,554 spectators turned up to watch the Division One clash with Leeds United, and by all accounts the ones that failed to show didn’t miss much.
Leeds ran out 3-0 winners thanks to two goals from Jim Storrie and one from Jimmy Greenhoff.
Arsenal were stuck in mid-table, finishing 14th at the end of the 1965/66 campaign. Two days after the defeat against Leeds, the Gunners beat Leicester City 1-0 in their final home game of the season.
The Yorkshire side were in second place when they faced Arsenal but their title hopes had gone with Liverpool already crowned as champions. Leeds held on to the runners-up spot despite a late challenge from Burnley.

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/lowest-attendance-for-leeds-loss

Strangely enough for a Gooner site the article doesn't mention one of the main reasons for such a low attendance:

This shocking attendance was partly due to Liverpool's Cup Winners' Cup final with Dortmund being televised live at the same time, in an era when football matches on TV were few and far between, but is still a stark reminder to all Gooners that the good times shouldn't be taken for granted.

Read more at http://talksport.com/magazine/featu...ord-hampden-park-and-more#8uo8KuTTQBbfezt6.99

 

[Spur of the moment]

Ironic that for the game the Axxxhole's go top this weekend they record their lowest official League attendance at the Emirates by some distance, just 50.002. They usually claim crowds of 60,000 even when large swathes of the ground are empty. Don't think they've ever reported a League gate at their current stadium below 59,000 prior to that.