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ITK Thread

Bishop said:
But he wouldn't sign Eze for the wing. He'd sign him (or not) for the central attacking positions.
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Maybe
I would think he would sign him (if he did) to play where he plays for palace… left of the 3
The role Doku plays
Maybe also in the role that Gungidan and the little Portuguese guy whose name I’ve forgotten plays… Fodens role too
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Maybe
I would think he would sign him (if he did) to play where he plays for palace… left of the 3
The role Doku plays
Maybe also in the role that Gungidan and the little Portuguese guy whose name I’ve forgotten plays… Fodens role too
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We disagree on where he plays. The majority of Palace games I watched he played centrally not as the LWF. If you check his heat maps it's matches up as do all of the statistically sites in regards to the position they believe he plays. They all say ACM like I see it.

He could play Silva and Foden's roles but that's where I think he lacks the finesse and in Gundogan's case he's not a DM capable player.
 
Bishop said:
We disagree on where he plays. The majority of Palace games I watched he played centrally not as the LWF. If you check his heat maps it's matches up as do all of the statistically sites in regards to the position they believe he plays. They all say ACM like I see it.

He could play Silva and Foden's roles but that's where I think he lacks the finesse and in Gundogan's case he's not a DM capable player.
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I’ve always seen him play left and drift
Like Gideon used to and kind alike doku could if he had the skills
I think he has the finesse. He knows what and when to move and pass and if… if we got him, I would be massively excited
Although it would leave us with a lot of players for that side
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I’ve always seen him play left and drift
Like Gideon used to and kind alike doku could if he had the skills
I think he has the finesse. He knows what and when to move and pass and if… if we got him, I would be massively excited
Although it would leave us with a lot of players for that side
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I'd be happy if we got him but I would expect him to play his actual position of ACM and not LWF as you assume. I don't think he lacks finesse, but I don't believe he has the level that Pep would likely want for an ACM. Eze is good but he's not that good if you think of the guys Pep has actually had playing that role over the years. For Spurs I think he'd be more than good enough and very likely an improvement over Maddison.
 
Bishop said:
I'd be happy if we got him but I would expect him to play his actual position of ACM and not LWF as you assume. I don't think he lacks finesse, but I don't believe he has the level that Pep would likely want for an ACM. Eze is good but he's not that good if you think of the guys Pep has actually had playing that role over the years. For Spurs I think he'd be more than good enough and very likely an improvement over Maddison.
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Pep hasn’t found any of the de Buyne/silva quality since them
Not sure they exist anymore except maybe at Barca or Olise
I think/hope you will see that finesse with eze playing with better players
 
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Muttley said:
I think Frank will play the double piviot midfield and Solanke up front. Now where the other 3 go, who knows. He's always been quite happy for Rico Henry to provide the width on the left and stretch teams. That has left Eze to go wide or go central based on the play. He's also had license to get into very advanced areas. So did Olise and Mbuemo in the same line-up but they all grafted together.
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Was there some b*stardised Brentford / Crystal Palace mashup where all these players played together???
 
Bullet said:
Was there some b*stardised Brentford / Crystal Palace mashup where all these players played together???
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Unless I'm mistaken Olise, Mbuemo and Eze must have played together. Surely with Toney as well when he wasn't banned. Wissa is more recent. I have a feeling Mbuemo would have covered for Toney when banned though.

Was it perhaps playing with Mbuemo and Olise that made Eze focus on playing more central?
 
Muttley said:
Unless I'm mistaken Olise, Mbuemo and Eze must have played together. Surely with Toney as well when he wasn't banned. Wissa is more recent. I have a feeling Mbuemo would have covered for Toney when banned though.

Was it perhaps playing with Mbuemo and Olise that made Eze focus on playing more central?
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What on earth are you going on about? 😂

Palace - Eze + Olise
Brentford - Mbuemo + Wissa + Toney

Afaia none of them have played for the other club
 
Bedfordspurs said:
He was statistically the best finisher around including ahead of Kane
And being great at one part of something doesn’t mean he is great at everything else (that would make him get in the Best side). Not that anyone has said he was or would
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Xg wise I imagine a lot of your stats reference is from long shots where he was more capable of worldys from outside of the box, but Kane was a better all round finisher.

Who knows what you're replying to in your second paragraph! I sure as fudge don't.
 
spurspinter1 said:
Xg wise I imagine a lot of your stats reference is from long shots where he was more capable of worldys from outside of the box, but Kane was a better all round finisher.

Who knows what you're replying to in your second paragraph! I sure as fudge don't.
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You said spurs fans put our players in the best XI didn’t you?
I think saying he was the best finisher on the planet isn’t wide of the mark. Even his close finishing was elite.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
You said spurs fans put our players in the best XI didn’t you?
I think saying he was the best finisher on the planet isn’t wide of the mark. Even his close finishing was elite.
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"Why do Spurs fans always think we have the best X in the world for most categories?" - No mention of a world XI, let's see if we can avoid trundling into yet another "Everyone explains what their own arbitrary definition of what world class means without budging, rendering any discourse completely pointless" chat, it's summer and we're bored without football, but not THAT bored hopefully.

Over the years, it's been Lloris is the best keeper in the world...Toby is the best ball playing CB in the world...Dembele is the best midfielder in the world....King would've been the best in the world yada yada yada

TBF it's often stating that the aforementioned players are the best in the league as opposed to the world so I'm perhaps indulging in a little hyperbole. But the key is it's mainly opinions that you'd only hear from Spurs fans. I'm not saying we haven't had some great players. It's hard to not make the case that Walker was one of, if not the best RB in the league for quite some time.

I'd agree that Son is an elite player, but stating an opinion that he was the best finisher in the world like it's a fact would be where I'd draw the line. Cases to be made for Bale and Modders being the best in the world for certain things as they went and did it on the biggest stage.
 
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spurspinter1 said:
"Why do Spurs fans always think we have the best X in the world for most categories?" - No mention of a world XI, let's see if we can avoid trundling into yet another "Everyone explains what their own arbitrary definition of what world class means without budging, rendering any discourse completely pointless" chat, it's summer and we're bored without football, but not THAT bored hopefully.

Over the years, it's been Lloris is the best keeper in the world...Toby is the best ball playing CB in the world...Dembele is the CB in the world....King would've been the best in the world yada yada yada

TBF it's often stating that the aforementioned players are the best in the league as opposed to the world so I'm perhaps indulging in a little hyperbole. But the key is it's mainly opinions that you'd only hear from Spurs fans. I'm not saying we haven't had some great players. It's hard to not make the case that Walker was one of, if not the best RB in the league for quite some time.

I'd agree that Son is an elite player, but stating an opinion that he was the best finisher in the world like it's a fact would be where I'd draw the line. Cases to be made for Bale and Modders being the best in the world for certain things as they went and it on the biggest stage.
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What I would say that is in Poch's early days we only really had one superstar - Lloris. We were concerned about him flying the nest and heading to one of the bigger European clubs. That was even confirmed in his autobiography as he was frustrated in his early days. Then we got to about 2017 and we had a team full of superstars. Every one of them was a big name and would have been sought after by other clubs.

Not sure I really care about whether our current or previous lot were world class or best in England/Europe/World etc. What I am wondering is whether we can replicate the 2015-2017 period and watch this current squad evolve into a team of superstars. Obviously with additions like we did with Toby, Big Vic, Dele and Sonny. In Poch's case, it only really took 2-3 years and then we were on the decline again even to the CL final when guys like Walker and Dembele had left, Big Vic was permanently crocked and Winks and Sissoko were the midfield duo.

I think the scouting networks at all the big clubs are so sophisticated now that it's even harder to pickup a Ronaldo or Messi as a teenager. Every club is on these players and the chances of us getting a Modric get harder.

Saying that, I am optimistic about our squad. It has so much potential.
 
Muttley said:
What I would say that is in Poch's early days we only really had one superstar - Lloris. We were concerned about him flying the nest and heading to one of the bigger European clubs. That was even confirmed in his autobiography as he was frustrated in his early days. Then we got to about 2017 and we had a team full of superstars. Every one of them was a big name and would have been sought after by other clubs.

Not sure I really care about whether our current or previous lot were world class or best in England/Europe/World etc. What I am wondering is whether we can replicate the 2015-2017 period and watch this current squad evolve into a team of superstars. Obviously with additions like we did with Toby, Big Vic, Dele and Sonny. In Poch's case, it only really took 2-3 years and then we were on the decline again even to the CL final when guys like Walker and Dembele had left, Big Vic was permanently crocked and Winks and Sissoko were the midfield duo.

I think the scouting networks at all the big clubs are so sophisticated now that it's even harder to pickup a Ronaldo or Messi as a teenager. Every club is on these players and the chances of us getting a Modric get harder.

Saying that, I am optimistic about our squad. It has so much potential.
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Right now we don’t have any superstars
IMO the best teams don’t have many if at all, because the drop off when you rely on that star is high (Arsenal died when they lost Odegaard for example)
What you do need is complementary players and ones who grow with the the team
People talk about buying ready made superstars but those players don’t really exist anymore
Pool have spent £110m on a player with 140 club games over 5 years. But he is young and IMO also brilliant. But is he a ready made superstar?
City haven’t brought any like that for some time (off the top of my head)
Teams are looking for the next big thing now
 
The strangest thing I’ve read today is that Arsenal have signed kepa and Nordgard as backs ups so it doesn’t matter that they aren’t very good (Arsenal fans argument)
Are they forgetting that the drop off from their first 11 is exactly why they don’t win trophies
 
Bedfordspurs said:
The strangest thing I’ve read today is that Arsenal have signed kepa and Nordgard as backs ups so it doesn’t matter that they aren’t very good (Arsenal fans argument)
Are they forgetting that the drop off from their first 11 is exactly why they don’t win trophies
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I've been reading about Norgaard for a week or so. He's 31 and on £40k a week and has just watched Frank move on. He's come off the back of a stellar season and he was the captain at Bees.

Partey is now out of contract and there are question marks whether he'll sign a new contract, not to mention the other non-football implications hanging around him. Jorginho has just left and gone to Flamengo as well.

Then there is another number 6, Lucien Agoumé. Linked with Arsenal as well as other clubs including us.

I'm guessing Norgaard could backfill Jorginho and Partey whilst they nurture another younger talent alongside.

I think my biggest read into all of this is that there could be a dearth of number 6's out there at a time when we could do with one.
 
spurspinter1 said:
"Why do Spurs fans always think we have the best X in the world for most categories?" - No mention of a world XI, let's see if we can avoid trundling into yet another "Everyone explains what their own arbitrary definition of what world class means without budging, rendering any discourse completely pointless" chat, it's summer and we're bored without football, but not THAT bored hopefully.

Over the years, it's been Lloris is the best keeper in the world...Toby is the best ball playing CB in the world...Dembele is the CB in the world....King would've been the best in the world yada yada yada

TBF it's often stating that the aforementioned players are the best in the league as opposed to the world so I'm perhaps indulging in a little hyperbole. But the key is it's mainly opinions that you'd only hear from Spurs fans. I'm not saying we haven't had some great players. It's hard to not make the case that Walker was one of, if not the best RB in the league for quite some time.

I'd agree that Son is an elite player, but stating an opinion that he was the best finisher in the world like it's a fact would be where I'd draw the line. Cases to be made for Bale and Modders being the best in the world for certain things as they went and it on the biggest stage.
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Never at any point in his life was Son a better finisher than Messi. That kills the idea of him being the best finisher in the world stoke dead.

I think this phenomenon exists because we weren't winning anything so the fans needed to latch on to something semi tangible and claiming X player is the best at something is both tangible but also largely unprovable and that's why it happens.
 
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