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***Tottenham v Brentford OMT***

someone needs to teach him how to say "process"

Team looked slow and lacking any strength at all. That is on the conditioning and preperation. But he also made a bad team selection. Against a physical team and good at set peices. We had a WHOLE new defence. Danso should have played. We sell Spence and Gray ends up playing Right back again. We cant judge this team until we have our first team choices. But damn. This was atrocious. Not one good sign.

I dont care if you told them yesterday we need to fight to become team. There was no sign of a team at all. We will Ruin Gray if we keep playing him as a Righ back. So Selling Spence makes zero sense now.
 
DeanoAustin said:
Only caught the last 35 today and it was dogbrick. Absolute dogbrick and very disappointing.

Here’s where I’m at on it though. Football is too knee jerk. Single games mean little in reality but become defining for a lot of fans. Even the best teams get bummed every now and then. Personally, I think we should be judging after 10 games or so. Give RDZ a chance and give the players a chance to settle in.

Very disappointing start but it’s just one game, it’s just 2.6% of the league season. Long, long way to go and I have faith in this manager.
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We put out a side that shouldn't play with an undercooked fitness level, away at a place that has a lot of continuity, played us very physically (we should have known). Not worried.

I told people in my circle Friday that this game was going to be a bad one even if I have faith in the season as a whole.
 
Mikey10 said:
There were bits of it I liked, but essentially he said that he knew we weren’t ready and he was surprised by how poor we were (which are actually contradictory statements when analysed).

Not sure that’s on too different a level to, “We are going to lose matches.”
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I was waiting...the main differences as I saw them.

1) He didn't say it.
2) He didn't say it last week or the week before or earlier.
3) I don't see them as contradictory at all. I took them as him saying we weren't really ready as he wants us to be, and he didn't expect us to be as poor as we were in terms of competing (which even a team not quite firing on all cylinders should not lack).

I'd also say that 'not ready' also edges at not having all the players he wanted, albeit he did not say that.
 
Bishop said:
I don't know if I think he needs to be sold but I do think he should not be starting games or even the first name off the bench. I think you get more consistent performances from Bentancur and Sarr as it stands. He is young so maybe it will come with time but as it stands his profile is way out of kilter with his ability and performances.
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You mention Sarr...is it just me, or is there a higher ceiing to Sarr/he's a little bit more effective than Gallagher, who is busy and bustles around a lot, yet Sarr is huge worker and has equal if not better quality on the ball?
 
Watching MOTD made me feel more positive.

Of the 6 games played so far 4/6 the bigger team/favourite has lost.

Arsenal won at home to a team where there is a major talent disadvantage. Everton had a starting XI where not a single player went to the World Cup.

We are still in pre season as are a handful of other teams and I think it will be that way until the first international break.

We also happened to play one of the teams that didn’t take a lot of players to the World Cup and look to be sharp already.
 
robp135 said:
Maybe the club has gone overboard in its injury prevention strategy? Rice & Saka as an example were absolutely broken at the World Cup but are straight back in to play 70 minutes on Friday.

Over the course of the season it could pay dividends. Other teams have players break down and we don’t.

Not just being overly cautious with anyone with a slight knock. Perhaps we did not push the players when it came to fitness in the pre season. I know that the running clubs use to do is a thing of the past compared (aside from Conte) but against have we gone to far the other way.

I am trying to think of a worse performance opening game of the season and I can’t as someone that’s been aware of what’s happening since the early 90’s. And in that time we have had managers left short in the transfer window and done many a tour to the other side of the world.
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All good points and questions...opening day drubbings...not quite the same but there was a 4-0 home defeat to West Ham first home game of the season in 81/82, however we had won 3-1 at Boro on first game of the season...
 
Very tough day for our new manager. What he learned today:

- Our left side is a shambles. Senesi didn't win a single physical dual on the ground or in the air for the entire first half. He doesn't do the basics well and doesn't have a great left back on his outside. Robbo was never a great defender because he didn't need to be in his prior gig. Some of his defending was horrible today. So the difference between VDV /Udogie vs Senesi / Robbo seems massive right now.

- Richi cannot play number 9 in this system. Admittedly, he had a really tough gig from the ref, Oliver, who gave him nothing all day. He was incredibly weak at playing with his back to goal and he let us down on multiple occasions. Definitely not the answer to our number 9.

- De Zerbi must surely know now that Bentancur is miles ahead of Gallagher and Bergval in the double pivot centre mid role. I don't think Tonali deserves to be free from criticism, but Berg and Gallagher were simply woeful. Gallager looked a yard slower than his opponents whilst Bergval played with absolutely no discipline. Mateus came on and me those 2 look like amateur footballers. Clearly, at 90% fitness he is miles ahead.

I said before the game that I only saw 3 "best eleven" in the lineup today. It showed.
 
Muttley said:
Very tough day for our new manager. What he learned today:

- Our left side is a shambles. Senesi didn't win a single physical dual on the ground or in the air for the entire first half. He doesn't do the basics well and doesn't have a great left back on his outside. Robbo was never a great defender because he didn't need to be in his prior gig. Some of his defending was horrible today. So the difference between VDV /Udogie vs Senesi / Robbo seems massive right now.

- Richi cannot play number 9 in this system. Admittedly, he had a really tough gig from the ref, Oliver, who gave him nothing all day. He was incredibly weak at playing with his back to goal and he let us down on multiple occasions. Definitely not the answer to our number 9.

- De Zerbi must surely know now that Bentancur is miles ahead of Gallagher and Bergval in the double pivot centre mid role. I don't think Tonali deserves to be free from criticism, but Berg and Gallagher were simply woeful. Gallager looked a yard slower than his opponents whilst Bergval played with absolutely no discipline. Mateus came on and me those 2 look like amateur footballers. Clearly, at 90% fitness he is miles ahead.

I said before the game that I only saw 3 "best eleven" in the lineup today. It showed.
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I get the best XI chat but can we actually think that way. Aside from Richarlison and Moore most of those players are going to play a significant role.
 
thfcsteff said:
You mention Sarr...is it just me, or is there a higher ceiing to Sarr/he's a little bit more effective than Gallagher, who is busy and bustles around a lot, yet Sarr is huge worker and has equal if not better quality on the ball?
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I think they are equal in terms of their best performance level but you will get that more consistently from Gallagher. Thats not to say I think Gallagher was a good singing. But over the course of a 38 game season I think Gallagher will contribute more.
 
robp135 said:
Maybe the club has gone overboard in its injury prevention strategy? Rice & Saka as an example were absolutely broken at the World Cup but are straight back in to play 70 minutes on Friday.

Over the course of the season it could pay dividends. Other teams have players break down and we don’t.

Not just being overly cautious with anyone with a slight knock. Perhaps we did not push the players when it came to fitness in the pre season. I know that the running clubs use to do is a thing of the past compared (aside from Conte) but against have we gone to far the other way.

I am trying to think of a worse performance opening game of the season and I can’t as someone that’s been aware of what’s happening since the early 90’s. And in that time we have had managers left short in the transfer window and done many a tour to the other side of the world.
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I actually felt much happier hearing RDZ say that we weren’t ready physically. Because it was such a bad, disjointed performance in a collective sense that it would worry me if we were fully ready to go and turned in that. At the elite level, this will happen if one side is just beyond physically.

I do think part of it is being extra careful with injuries, and to be honest I don’t blame him with that. The situation at the club has been completely ludicrous for two seasons. So whatever it takes to not get back there, we should do it.

I do think it’s interesting to think about why so many players aren’t up to speed yet though? Is it all the World Cup? Is it the structure of our pre season? How can it be that we reach the opening day with so many players not properly equipped to play?
 
SissokoWasGood (BoL) said:
I actually felt much happier hearing RDZ say that we weren’t ready physically. Because it was such a bad, disjointed performance in a collective sense that it would worry me if we were fully ready to go and turned in that. At the elite level, this will happen if one side is just beyond physically.

I do think part of it is being extra careful with injuries, and to be honest I don’t blame him with that. The situation at the club has been completely ludicrous for two seasons. So whatever it takes to not get back there, we should do it.

I do think it’s interesting to think about why so many players aren’t up to speed yet though? Is it all the World Cup? Is it the structure of our pre season? How can it be that we reach the opening day with so many players not properly equipped to play?
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Out of total squad

- Maddison, Kudus, Deki, Xavi, Odobert, Solanke, VDV, Udogie, all either injured or returning from injury (8 players), this btw is what has killed us in last two seasons, walking into a season already light because of existing injuries
- Bentancur, Danso, Porro, Senesi, JPVH, Roberston world cup late arrivals
- Fernandes & Tonali are the new boys

So out of established/expected starting 11

- Kinsky, Richi & Tel have had full pre-season
- Bergvall, Gray and Gallagher have played but have ofte been shifted around and aren't first choice
- We are expecting at least 2 (Savinho & Marmoush) starters to join team still.

Undercooked, transfer window not done and new boys either adapting or not here.

Lets see 10 games in.
 
Just got home, little bit drunk, and I'm not bothered to much by today's result..... Ok a little.

Not one of the Brentford fans I met in Kew tonight had a bad word to say to me, or try wind me up. Very humble fans. Nice people.

Every one of them said basically the same thing, this was one bad game for us, a brick start, but don't expect us to do the same once we got our full team together.

I couldn't agree more.

Anyway, goodnight, drunk and can't write properly.
 
we looked better after all the experienced players came together, but we still lacked something up front, when brentford packed 11 players in the box.

fernandez looked great when he came on, so composed. tonali looked more interested when he came on.

i can see why dezerbi wants savinho, marmoush and gakpo.

one positive is that all the young ones - moore, bergvall, gray and tel - can see that they are not that good when it comes to men's football (yet) so will keep them grounded.

one negative is that brentford showed how to nullify dezerbi's famed build from the back play. maybe a new front three is exactly what we need.
 
Kandi1977 said:
We will get absolutely dominated on set pieces all season with VDV, Sensi and Van Hecke! They are all absolutely useless in the air, and I tell you, we will suffer for it!
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Not only that but their lack of strength means players are gonna find it very easy to hold up the ball against us. Thiago found it incredibly easy yesterday. We badly need Kudus back for some kind of hold up play.
 
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